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Subject: Percy-L: Literary, Religious, Scientific, and Philosophical Discussion of Walker Percy

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  • From: "RHONDA MCDONNELL" <rhonda_mcdonnell AT msn.com>
  • To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org, jsbaughm AT gwm.sc.edu
  • Subject: Re: [percy-l] Lancelot, jihadists, and the terror of false peace
  • Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2007 11:44:01 -0700

When Percy writes about the situation we face when the bombs don't drop, he's responding to this from William Faulkner's Nobel Prize Acceptance Speech:

Our tragedy today is a general and universal physical fear so long sustained by now that we can even bear it. There are no longer problems of the spirit. There is only one question: When will I be blown up? Because of this, the young man or woman writing today has forgotten the problems of the human heart in conflict with itself which alone can make good writing because only that is worth writing about, worth the agony and the sweat. He must learn them again. He must teach himself that the basest of all things is to be afraid: and, teaching himself that, forget it forever, leaving no room in his workshop for anything but the old verities and truths of the heart, the universal truths lacking which any story is ephemeral and doomed--love and honor and pity and pride and compassion and sacrifice. Until he does so, he labors under a curse. He writes not of love but of lust, of defeats in which nobody loses anything of value, and victories without hope and worst of all, without pity or compassion. His griefs grieve on no universal bones, leaving no scars. He writes not of the heart but of the glands.

Until he learns these things, he will write as though he stood among and watched the end of man. . . .

It's the everydayness and the resulting complacency that Percy fights against--the sort that a bad peace would bring, although we might want to define what "bad peace" really is.

--Rhonda

"I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing
than teach ten thousand stars how not to dance"
 
                                    e.e. cummings

From: "Michael Larson" <Mlarson AT SOUTHEASTMN.EDU>
Reply-To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion" <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
To: <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
Subject: [percy-l] Lancelot, jihadists, and the terror of false peace
Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2006 13:58:02 -0600
>I think neither Lancelot nor the jihadists are interested in changing the world. In blowing things up, the jihadist seeks the respect of Allah and eternal reward for himself; Lancelot seeks revenge--on God, on his wife--and a definitive end to the misery of Belle Isle, himself included. His motivation is despair, not social reform.
>
>In asking the question about the bombs not dropping, Percy is not lobbying for peace. Consistently throughout his work, his message is that meaningless peace is worse even than war. In other words, peace, in and of itself, is not the highest good. What is most terrifying in his question about the bombs is the intimation that the world might someday work itself into an amorphous, creedless, humanistic kind of peace that rendered nothing--absolutely nothing--worth fighting for.
>
>Regards,
>Michael Larson
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org on behalf of percy-l-request AT lists.ibiblio.org
>Sent: Sat 12/30/2006 11:00 AM
>To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
>Subject: Percy-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue 7
>
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>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Lancelot the Jihadist (robert.g.eckert AT us.army.mil)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 13:05:36 -0500
>From: <robert.g.eckert AT us.army.mil>
>Subject: Re: [percy-l] Lancelot the Jihadist
>To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
>Message-ID: <e2c9f2a81d18.459512a0 AT us.army.mil>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>List,
>
>The jihadists and Lancelot have in mind a perfect world and lament the messy real world around them. Both think they can change the world by blowing things up.
>
>Maybe both are explained by the will to power. Weak people can feel strong for a moment by destroying, say, a thousand year old Buddha statue or a couple of big buildings.
>
>It is not possible for the world to be good enough for those types. All that we imperfect but peaceful people can do is keep destructive perfectionists away from explosives. No easy task.
>
>We better keep them away from WMD level devices.
>
>Somewhere Percy asks "What happens if the bombs don't drop." I think we now have an answer. Rather than a worldwide nuclear war, we have a constant and very real threat of tactical nukes being used by people with whom it is impossible to negotiate.
>
>SPC Robert Eckert
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Michael Larson <Mlarson AT SOUTHEASTMN.EDU>
>Date: Thursday, December 28, 2006 7:30 pm
>Subject: [percy-l] Lancelot the Jihadist
>
> > An interesting observation, Rich Gray, about Lancelot Lamar. He is
> > perhaps, at least prior to ending up in a mental prison, a
> > jihadist of sorts: he does blow up the "infidels" with no regard
> > for his own safety. But there is no expectation of eternal reward
> > when he engages in this act. That is to say, he does not do it for
> > religious reasons but rather for the failure of religion, and in
> > particular, the Catholic religion.
> >
> > The section you quote from the novel is an anguished Percy himself
> > speaking through Lance. For the first time in the 1900-year
> > history of the Church, it had tried officially and universally,
> > through the Second Vatican Council, to make friends with the
> > world. By the time Percy wrote Lancelot (in the 1970s), he could
> > already perceive (the canary in the coal mine) the disastrous
> > results of this duplicity. Clearly, it grieved him, for he had
> > staked everything on the Church's impermeability, its
> > otherworldliness, and he saw that evaporating (at least in the
> > popular church) before his very eyes.
> >
> > If Lancelot's idealogy divides the sheep and the goats, it does
> > nothing more than orthodox Christianity has always done (a theme
> > in the Gospels, The Apocalypse, The City of God, etc.). Lancelot's
> > error is not in his divisive instinct (the sword, which Christ
> > claimed to bring, does indeed divide), but in his vigilante
> > justice. Since he has given up on God, he assumes for himself the
> > role of dispensing justice as he sees fit.
> >
> > At the end of our world, justice (as well as mercy) truly will be
> > served. In the world of Belle Isle, it is even possible that
> > Lancelot became an actual instrument of true justice. But even if
> > that were the case, it would merely be the workings of God's
> > providence and by no means an intrinsic validation of Lancelot's
> > objectively evil act.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Michael Larson
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org on behalf of percy-l-
> > request AT lists.ibiblio.orgSent: Sat 12/23/2006 11:00 AM
> > To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subject: Percy-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue 5
> >
> > Send Percy-L mailing list submissions to
> > percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/percy-l
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > percy-l-request AT lists.ibiblio.org
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > percy-l-owner AT lists.ibiblio.org
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Percy-L digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Re: Believers... (Gray, Rich)
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ---
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2006 12:52:24 -0500
> > From: "Gray, Rich" <RGray AT montreat.edu>
> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] Believers...
> > To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> > <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> > Message-ID:
> > <CAC5B33076E9264A9E79A4F6145C23FA05267DEF AT e2kmail.montreat.edu>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >
> > I am not persuaded that any non-Arab understands jihadists. Maybe no
> > Arabs understand them either. But Arabs will probably be first to
> > figure them out.
> >
> >
> >
> > Percy's Lancelot Lamar is a terrorist, mentally unbalanced,
> > disappointedin life, and holding to a rationalized ideology that
> > permits him to
> > divide the whole culture into sheep and goats, with himself as god.
> > Like jihadists, his killing has little or no correction on the social
> > misbehavior he deplores. Like jihadists, Lance expected to die in his
> > executing explosion of his home, Belle Isle. Ranting is Lance's
> > lingo:
> >
> >
> > "I cannot tolerate this age. And I will not. I might have tolerated
> > you and your Catholic Church, and even joined it, if you had remained
> > true to yourself. Now you're part of the age. You've the same
> > fleas as
> > the dogs you've lain down with. I would have felt at home at
> > Mont-Saint-Michel [loads of irony here], the Mount of the
> > Archangel [?]
> > with the flaming sword, or with Richard Coeur de Lion at Acre [more
> > irony]. They believed in a god who said he came not to bring
> > peace but
> > the sword. Make love not war? I'll take war rather than what
> > this age
> > calls love." (pp. 157-8)
> >
> >
> >
> > Rich Gray
> >
> >
> >
> > I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen, not
> > onlybecause I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
> >
> > C.S. Lewis
> >
> > _____
> >
> > From: RHONDA MCDONNELL [mailto:rhonda_mcdonnell AT msn.com]
> > Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 11:37 PM
> > To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] Believers...
> >
> >
> >
> > So what do you all think Percy might make of the jihadists? I've been
> > wondering that lately, in light of his thoughts regarding Nazi Germany
> > and the "tenderness leads to terror" concept that he and Flannery
> > O'Connor shared. We can't accuse the jihadists of falling prey to
> > scientific humanism, that's for sure. But what to make of their
> > sort of
> > belief? It seems to me to be as abstracted as any -ism out there, but
> > I'm looking from the outside. Anyone with insight?
> >
> > --Rhonda
> >
> > "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing
> > than teach ten thousand stars how not to dance"
> >
> > e.e. cummings
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> >
> > From: <Robert_Pauley AT oxy.com>
> > Reply-To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical Discussion"
> > <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> > To: <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] Believers...
> > Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:25:39 -0800
> >
> > Rhonda: I was drawn in to a running conversation about God with
> > a group of men. The sort of conversation which, to quite Percy,
> > "give me
> > a neckache." This passage came to me, vaguely, but with a memory of
> > pungent satisfaction. (Percy's ruminations on faith are always on the
> > edges of my consciousness, I guess). I remembered how Percy
> > managed to
> > displease everybody and yet get at the old dilemma of faith in a fresh
> > way. I, too, wanted to displease and provoke. I also thought it
> > was a
> > good opportunity to introduce Percy to a bunch of young people.
> >
> > regards, R
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> >
> > From: percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > [mailto:percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of RHONDA
> > MCDONNELL Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 4:09 PM
> > To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] Believers...
> >
> > Just for curiousity's sake, what are you using the passage for?
> >
> > --Rhonda
> >
> > "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing
> > than teach ten thousand stars how not to dance"
> >
> > e.e. cummings
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> >
> > From: <Robert_Pauley AT oxy.com>
> > Reply-To: "Percy-L: Literary and Philosophical
> > Discussion" <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> > To: <percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] Believers...
> > Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:55:08 -0800
> >
> > Found it referred to in an essay by Kent Gramm. From The
> > Second Coming. Of course it is much longer than this. Thank you.
> >
> >
> >
> > Excerpts:
> >
> > There are only two classes of people, the believers and
> > the unbelievers. The only difficulty is deciding which is the more
> > feckless.
> >
> > ... As unacceptable as believers are, unbelievers are
> > even worse.
> >
> > ... The present day unbeliever is crazy because he finds
> > himself born into a world of endless wonders, having no notion how he
> > got here, a world in which he eats, sleeps ... works, grows old, gets
> > sick, and dies, and... Not once in his entire life does it cross his
> > mind to say to himself that his situation is preposterous...
> >
> > ... The more intelligent he is, the crazier he is... He
> > is as insane as a French intellectual.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> >
> > From: percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > [mailto:percy-l-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of
> > RobtSchaefer AT aol.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 3:33 PM
> > To: percy-l AT lists.ibiblio.org
> > Subject: Re: [percy-l] Believers...
> >
> > "To people! To unbelievers and to so-called believers."
> > ...
> >
> >
> >
> > Fr. Smith is talking to Tom More about how words have
> > been deprived of their meaning.
> >
> >
> >
> > The Thanatos Syndrome, Section II, part 6 (or chapter 6)
> >
> >
> >
> > R. Schaefer
> >
> > Mobile
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >--
> > >An archive of all list discussion is available at
> > https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
> > >
> > >Visit the Walker Percy Project at
> > http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> >
> > Experience the magic of the holidays. Talk to Santa on
> > Messenger. <http://g.msn.com/8HMAENUS/2743??PS=47575>
> >
> > >--
> > >An archive of all list discussion is available at
> > https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
> > >
> > >Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> > The MSN Entertainment Guide to Golden Globes is here. Get all the
> > scoop.<http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2740??PS=47575>
> >
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> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> >
> >
> > End of Percy-L Digest, Vol 43, Issue 5
> > **************************************
> >
> >
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>--
>An archive of all list discussion is available at https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
>
>Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy
>
>------------------------------
>
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><< winmail.dat >>

>--
>An archive of all list discussion is available at https://lists.ibiblio.org/sympa/arc/percy-l/
>
>Visit the Walker Percy Project at http://www.ibiblio.org/wpercy



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