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[Jwlehman@aol.com]

In a message dated 8/2/2013 7:12:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
jerrydana5@aol.com writes:

> I have some persimmon trees I have grown from seed and they are about 12 
> feet high.  No fruit yet. When should they begin bearing?  And should I 
> trim them to make them more fruitful?  Jerry in southern Indiana
> 

Hi Jerry,

At 12 feet they should be bearing. Have you seen flowers? Could they be 
males? 

I'd wait now until next spring then prune off the lower limbs lower than 
maybe 5 feet or 6 ft.  And prune out limbs that are crowding other limbs, 
balancing out the tree. 

Jerry
West central Indiana  
>From alandhaigh@gmail.com  Sat Aug  3 08:15:55 2013
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Squirrel Strategies, 2012



As far as I know, there are no studies that have carefully evaluated
various strategies to stop squirrels from climbing up the trunks of trees,
so I=E2=80=99ve had to rely on random experimentation to try to discover a =
method
that takes the least possible time to install that effectively deters these
pests from climbing fruit trees and taking fruit.

I=E2=80=99ve tried aluminum flashing (roofing coil) which commonly comes as=
 2=E2=80=99 wide
rolls of various lengths from which I cut wide enough pieces to completely
wrap around the trunk of trees to be protected.   At least four and
preferably five feet of distance is required from the ground to first
branches to exclude squirrels from jumping up to a branch to get aboard.  I
believe it takes about 3=E2=80=99 of trunk wrap starting one or two feet ab=
ove the
ground as squirrels I=E2=80=99ve watched have cleared 2=E2=80=99 from prone=
 position
jumping from where they are holding onto the trunk.  I=E2=80=99ve always in=
cluded
something- either tangle trap to annoy them, just outside the metal or axle
grease on the metal to stop traction.

This has been fairly affective and most years protects trees at most
orchards I manage.   I=E2=80=99m confident that squirrels have been deterre=
d
because some fruit often has already been removed by the time I get
installations done and the removal usually stops immediately after
installation.  However this year my failure rate has been unacceptably high=
.

As I already mentioned, I used to augment the metal with an extremely
sticky compound called tangle trap.  I would put a 6=E2=80=9D ring of it at=
 the top
or both the top and bottom of the metal cylinder if the metal proved
insufficient in itself.  I stopped doing this because too many birds were
getting killed by contacting the stuff and it was horrible to work with- it
didn=E2=80=99t always work anyway.

This year I spread axle grease on the metal instead and that solved the
problem of squirrels pulling themselves up the metal at many sites.  Howeve=
r
at some sites squirrels eventually began climbing the metal anyway.  From
the scratch marks they left in the grease it appears to have been a
struggle.

Someone suggested on an internet thread I read that straight metal works
better than greased metal because squirrels can actually get more traction
from grease, but this year I used grease at most sites.  I now believe the
suggestion may be valid as scratch marks on the grease and grease on the
trees indicates that greased metal was not always reliable.  On my site,
squirrels were climbing greased metal and removing apples from two trees
but seem to have stopped once grease was removed- but maybe they just
stopped.   I believe the grease may provide more traction when nights get
cooler.  Brushing some motor oil on metal weekly may be a better tactic.

I believe now that while 4=E2=80=99 of branchless trunk is often adequate,
squirrels are capable of jumping higher- at least some squirrels, some
sites and 5=E2=80=99 may sometimes be necessary.

What I=E2=80=99m not at all sure of is the reliability of aluminum flashing
compared to metal duct pipe.  This is important because stapling aluminum
is quicker and cheaper than dealing with duct pipe.  Also the flashing
comes in painted rolls making it more attractive.  The staples on the
flashing may create enough traction for squirrels to climb but on the two
apple trees on my property I=E2=80=99ve got flashing on one and duct pipe o=
n the
other and the squirrels stopped removing apples from both once I removed
the grease.

The duct pipe can't be attached too close to the trunks when using the self
closure and so it must start at ground level or something metal like
chicken wire must be wedged in to stop squirrels from squeezing in between
metal and trunk.

I have found netting to be somewhat useful- I use double strand woven
netting available from 7 Springs Organics, and with trees too low for
baffling it worked at a couple of sites this year although hungry squirrels
will often chew through them- you just can=E2=80=99t be sure.   Where the n=
etting
did work best was in combination with flashing on trees with inadequate
length of trunk to work with flashing alone.

I should also note that Mylar cylinders around trunks failed me this
season, apparently because it is so thin that squirrels can press it
against the tree to get traction.  Also, in the past, I've tried hot pepper
spray and predator urine without any affect at all.

It is possible that the reason the metal flashing is inconsistent is the
variability of the diameter of the trees I protect and that squirrels can
pull themselves up thinner trunks even with the metal but not wider trunks.
 Duct pipe (thin metal =E2=80=9Cstove=E2=80=9D pipe) could solve this probl=
em as thicker
pipe can be placed around thinner trunks.