North American Fruit Explorers mailing list at ibiblio

[Steven C <filtertitle@aol.com>]

@Gina: highbush cranberry (Viburnum) is about as much a true cranberry 
(Vaccinium) as a date-plum persimmon is a proper plum; highbush cranberries 
superficially look similar to cranberries and both are acidic, requiring 
winter-bleeting.  

SC

On Nov 18, 2012, at 12:00 PM, nafex-request@lists.ibiblio.org wrote:

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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1.  "Wild" Pear - Ripening and Recipes? (Peter Chrisbacher)
>   2. Re:  Fwd: Johny A. (Lawrence F. London, Jr.)
>   3. Re:  "Wild" Pear - Ripening and Recipes? (dwoodard@becon.org)
>   4. Re:  "Wild" Pear - Ripening and Recipes? (Lawrence F. London, Jr.)
>   5.  American Highbush Cranberry - NATIVE cultivars. (Steven Covacci)
>   6. Re:  American Highbush Cranberry - NATIVE cultivars.
>      (Ginda Fisher)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2012 15:08:15 -0500
> From: Peter Chrisbacher <pxbacher@gmail.com>
> Subject: [nafex] "Wild" Pear - Ripening and Recipes?
> To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID:
>    <CAPmZpfN-5hk9NDb8mrsGU-1zj11Qho3jH4HG8uJ3V6SyZv1aww@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> Hello All -
> 
> Last weekend I stumbled across what appears to me to be a very large old
> wild pear tree here in Wilmington DE. The tree still has lots of pears
> hanging on its branches, as well as loads of fruit still in good shape (and
> rock hard) on the ground around it.
> 
> Assuming this is actually a "wild" tree, these pears are quite large - the
> one I'm looking at now is just slightly smaller than a bartlett. Nearby the
> tree is an overgrown apple tree that appears quite a bit younger than the
> pear tree.
> 
> I am quite sure I can collect at least two and probably more 5-gallon pails
> of fruit from around this tree.  This being the case, I have a few
> questions for the group:
> 
> 1) Any thoughts on whether this is a seedling pear or may actually be a
> cultivar?  I see no indication of grafting on the tree.
> 2) If possibly not a seedling, how might I go about typing it?
> 3) These pears are rock hard, despite storing 5 in a paper bag at room temp
> for the past week. They're juicy enough, but are tart and mildly tannic.
> Do I have any hope of ripening them, or would I be better off processing
> them in some way?
> 4) What might be the best way(s) to try ripening and/or processing some of
> these?  I'm willing to experiment by trying different things this year
> thinking ahead to next year's harvest
> 
> Here's a pic of one of the pears:
> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/SrbRngldHoADQFNNTHTVrtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Pete Chrisbacher
> Zone 6b/7a Southeast PA
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2012 19:34:30 -0500
> From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lflj@bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: [nafex] Fwd: Johny A.
> To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <50A82D16.4010809@bellsouth.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> On 11/11/2012 3:46 PM, Douglas Hinds wrote:
> 
>>>>> That isn't to take away from Johnny. He was an apple authority and went
>>>> around the country helping folks and propagated popular varieties by 
>>>> grafting.
>>> Actually, according to Pollan's book, Johny thought grafting was devil's
>>> work and that God wanted trees to grow just as they were from seed.
>> God and Johnny aren't the only ones.  Count me in on that two.
>> 
>> How important is it to me?  I left the USA due to the relative dearth of
>> fruit from seedling trees there in 1974 and I still don't eat fruit from
>> trees that _aren't_  on their own roots.  In fact, fruit from seedling
>> trees is the principle staple food of my diet and at 70, I have not yet
>> begun to go downhill.
>> 
>> An article explaining the reasons why was published in the *1973
>> California Rare Fruit Growers Yearbook* (the year before I left).  Steve
>> Diver asked for for a copy and I e-mailed it to him about 12 years ago.
>> (If Steve is on nafex I'd appreciate being sent a copy, since I don't
>> have it on hand at this time.  And if not, Lawrence - I assume you have
>> his current contact data, and I hope you can do me the favor of sending
>> this on to him).
> 
> I will forward this to him. Here is his contact info from the sanet list:
> 
> Steve Diver
> steved@IPA.NET
> http://www.agri-synergy.com
> 
>> Grafting is unnecessary and creates more problems than it solves.
>> Logically, those subscribing to organic, biological, alternative,
>> sustainable and ecological (as well as permaculture and biodynamic)
>> agriculture would recognize the importance of respecting and maintaining
>> the integrity of the individual organism as a fundamental and
>> unalterable principle, yet no movement (that I'm aware of) has taken up
>> the cause and I think I (along with other sympathetic individuals and
>> groups) need to do something about that.  (It's on the agenda we've
>> established with CUCBA, our local Agricultural, Biological,
>> Environmental and Animal Sciences Faculty) <www.cucba.udg.mx> and as
>> time and funding permit, we will be moving ahead with it.
>> 
>> That's all for now, but I can elaborate further if this post generates
>> any interest to that effect.
>> 
>> Douglas Hinds,
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2012 03:06:49 -0500
> From: <dwoodard@becon.org>
> Subject: Re: [nafex] "Wild" Pear - Ripening and Recipes?
> To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <5119a33012bf1f14eef9519e0405c616@becon.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> 
> Pete, European pears may differ in their behaviour.
> 
> The classic ripening technique for European fresh eating pears is: 50 
> to 70 degrees F. (cooler is usually though not always better) in a 
> closed container. Sometimes a preliminary period of cold storage is best 
> (said to be 2 months for Anjou). My experience is that ripening Ontario 
> grown Anjous taken from cold storage in January produces an absolutely 
> delicious fruit. Note that some European pears apparently need months of 
> root cellar type storage ("common storage") to ripen. In the old days 
> apparently winter pears such as Josephine de Malines and Winter Nelis 
> were kept in common storage and would ripen well into winter.
> 
> European cooking pears (e.g. Catillac) are said to require cooking for 
> 2 hours even after months of storage. Reputedly they are easy to store 
> in good condition. I have no personal experience with them.
> 
> I don't know anything about Oriental pears and hybrids, except that I 
> have been told that well grown Kieffers respond well to a few weeks 
> common storage, and limited personal experience suggests that it is so.
> 
> I suggest that if possible you try different treatments on several 
> different batches.
> 
> Doug Woodard
> St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada
> 
> 
> On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 15:08:15 -0500, Peter Chrisbacher 
> <pxbacher@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello All -
>> 
>> Last weekend I stumbled across what appears to me to be a very large 
>> old
>> wild pear tree here in Wilmington DE. The tree still has lots of 
>> pears
>> hanging on its branches, as well as loads of fruit still in good 
>> shape (and
>> rock hard) on the ground around it.
>> 
>> Assuming this is actually a "wild" tree, these pears are quite large 
>> - the
>> one I'm looking at now is just slightly smaller than a bartlett. 
>> Nearby the
>> tree is an overgrown apple tree that appears quite a bit younger than 
>> the
>> pear tree.
>> 
>> I am quite sure I can collect at least two and probably more 5-gallon 
>> pails
>> of fruit from around this tree.  This being the case, I have a few
>> questions for the group:
>> 
>> 1) Any thoughts on whether this is a seedling pear or may actually be 
>> a
>> cultivar?  I see no indication of grafting on the tree.
>> 2) If possibly not a seedling, how might I go about typing it?
>> 3) These pears are rock hard, despite storing 5 in a paper bag at 
>> room temp
>> for the past week. They're juicy enough, but are tart and mildly 
>> tannic.
>> Do I have any hope of ripening them, or would I be better off 
>> processing
>> them in some way?
>> 4) What might be the best way(s) to try ripening and/or processing 
>> some of
>> these?  I'm willing to experiment by trying different things this 
>> year
>> thinking ahead to next year's harvest
>> 
>> Here's a pic of one of the pears:
>> 
>> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/SrbRngldHoADQFNNTHTVrtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Pete Chrisbacher
>> Zone 6b/7a Southeast PA
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2012 10:05:52 -0500
> From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lflj@bellsouth.net>
> Subject: Re: [nafex] "Wild" Pear - Ripening and Recipes?
> To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <50A8F950.5060800@bellsouth.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> On 11/17/2012 3:08 PM, Peter Chrisbacher wrote:
> 
>> 4) What might be the best way(s) to try ripening and/or processing some of
>> these?  I'm willing to experiment by trying different things this year
>> thinking ahead to next year's harvest
> 
> Pear preserves with ginger and lemon slices, medium to large pieces of 
> fruit are used. Coarse grind it all and turn it into a marmalade or even 
> finer, into a jam. This is one of the very best traditional Southern 
> recipes. Might try adding slices of apple and apricot and sweeten with 
> honey or organic turbinado sugar, add brandy, don;t know about maple 
> syrup, but possibly. Don't know about cloves, maybe a very small amount. 
> Recipe would be similar to that for preserved peaches and watermelon 
> rind pickle. The ginger and lemon flavors are important. Flavor ratios 
> might be:
> 
> pear 35%
> ginger 25%
> lemon 25%
> the rest 15%
> 
> I rate this sweet even higher than Keiller's Dundee Marmalade and
> Gooseberry Jam and equal to my favorite homemade wild plum jam.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2012 10:27:48 -0500 (EST)
> From: Steven Covacci <filtertitle@aol.com>
> Subject: [nafex] American Highbush Cranberry - NATIVE cultivars.
> To: nafex@lists.ibiblio.org
> Message-ID: <8CF93B865FCD808-83C-DC71@webmail-d050.sysops.aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> 
> 
> I'm interested in growing American Highbush Cranberry (but strictly native 
> cultivars; even if hybrids between V. opulus spp. americanum & V. 
> acerifolium).
> I have 'Wentworth', but it hasn't yet fruited - I have no idea if the 
> berries are really as great as some have described for making jam and, to a 
> limited extent - fresh eating; the European subspecies tastes and smells 
> disgusting.
> So, I'm considering getting other native cultivars: Hahns, Alfredo, Redwing 
> [JN Select], etc.
> Does anyone have these or other cultivars (native)?
> Thanks,
> Steve; NJ
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2012 10:38:10 -0500
> From: Ginda Fisher <list@ginda.us>
> Subject: Re: [nafex] American Highbush Cranberry - NATIVE cultivars.
> To: nafex mailing list at ibiblio <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <ED1220DE-701E-4894-9C6C-062D6842E9C6@ginda.us>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> 
> On Nov 18, 2012, at 10:27 AM, Steven Covacci wrote:
> 
>> 
>> 
>> I'm interested in growing American Highbush Cranberry (but strictly native 
>> cultivars; even if hybrids between V. opulus spp. americanum & V. 
>> acerifolium).
>> I have 'Wentworth', but it hasn't yet fruited - I have no idea if the 
>> berries are really as great as some have described for making jam and, to 
>> a limited extent - fresh eating; the European subspecies tastes and smells 
>> disgusting.
>> So, I'm considering getting other native cultivars: Hahns, Alfredo, 
>> Redwing [JN Select], etc.
>> Does anyone have these or other cultivars (native)?
>> Thanks,
>> Steve; NJ
> 
> I thought the cranberries people eat are low, bog-growing plants. I didn't 
> realize there were high bush cranberries that produced worth-while fruit. 
> Is there any commercial cultivation of these?
> 
> Ginda
> MA
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
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