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nafex - Re: [NAFEX] Asian/American Plums

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  • From: Douglas Woodard <dwoodard@becon.org>
  • To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Asian/American Plums
  • Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 20:19:08 -0500

One additional factor:

I've been told that Kahinta (a hybrid plum I believe) takes 8 years to come into full bearing, or to bear at all (my recollection is not clear over 20 years or so).

Also, about 20 years ago a local Niagara Peninsula fruit grower told me that Vanier (named by Vineland, Ottawa-bred, reportedly Japanese/Prunus salicina, reportedly a Burbank seedling, I don't know whether open-pollinated or not) while it starts bearing around 4 years or so, does not come into full bearing (in relation to tree size) until about 8 years old. I think this would be on Myrobalan rootstock.

I suspect that these days a lot of people draw conclusions before a tree is 8 years old, when perhaps they should wait for maybe 10 years.

Doug Woodard
St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada



John Bunker wrote:
I agree with Jim that most of what has been written in books (and there hasn't been much) about hybrid plum pollination is inaccurate or just copied from someone else. However, there is some good stuff out there, including FA Waugh's Plums and Plum Culture, written in 1901. I have read and re-read many times the Saskatchewan article to which Melissa refers. I consider it to be the best attempt yet at an intelligent explanation of plum pollination.
We have about 40 hybrid plum trees on our farm in central Maine, including most - but not all- of the common ones and several that are more rare. We grow them in clusters of 3-12 trees, with trees spaced about 3-6 feet apart. Until we planted straight species (P. americana) we got fruit, but never had great crops. Out best years have all been since the species have begun to flower.

This is still anecdotal evidence however. This year in central Maine, many growers had huge crops, seemingly no matter what they did or didn't do. And of course, in many areas there is the issue of plum curculio which may (or may not) play a key role in cropping.
Some factors that may effect pollination include:
Unlike P. domestica and a number of other Prunus species, hybrids are thought to be not self-fruitful. Hybrid plums are obviously hybrids and as hybrids, they have reduced amounts of viable pollen. (Think mules.)
Hybrid plum varieties have differing flowering periods from one another, not always overlapping.
The timing of what viable male pollen there is in hybrid plums does not necessarily correlate with female receptivity in neighboring trees. There are several different species combinations that fall under the banner of "hybrid plum". Some of those combinations are known, some guessed at, some unknown. Some even exhibit "European" type characteristics and/or susceptibilities. Superior is a plum with an odd history. While the literature generally calls it: Burbank (P. salicina) x Kaga (P. americana x P. simonii), in the old catalogs (30+ years ago) I have seen Superior referred to as both a hybrid and a European.
Unfortunately, breeders and nurseries pretty much gave up on hybrid plums decades ago, for what ever reason. As such, a good deal of what's floating around may or may not even be correctly identified. The best source of a variety is a grower who knows the fruit and has bearing trees. That's one of the beauties of grafting your own. If possible, I always "go to the tree" when I want to add to the collection.

With best regards,
John Bunker

Fedco
trees@fedcoseeds.com <mailto:trees@fedcoseeds.com>
www.fedcoseeds.com PO Box 520
Waterville ME 04903
207-873-7333
fax: 207-872-8317







On Nov 17, 2008, at 4:30 PM, Melissa Kacalanos wrote:

<http://www.usask.ca/agriculture/plantsci/dom_fruit/articles/plums.pdf>




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