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  • From: Road's End Farm <organic87 AT frontiernet.net>
  • To: Market Farming <market-farming AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [Market-farming] GAP summary (long)
  • Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:52:02 -0400


Kathryn, first, thanks very much for that thoughtful post.

Comments on a few items follow:  


On Mar 15, 2010, at 12:31 PM, KAKerby AT aol.com wrote:

 the presence of one form of E coli is sufficient to be concerned about the presence of more toxic forms.  

Again, at the FDA meeting we were told that there is little if any evidence that the presence of beneficial E coli is useful as an indicator of whether pathogens are present.

 One of the specific things I asked during that second workshop was whether E coli survival rates had been tested in certified organic ground; those results are being compiled now but seem to be fairly consistent with previous results that E coli can remain viable in soil up to 200 days after application.  

I have heard this also, at a recent soils science meeting for organic growers held in Ithaca; though would still like to see the studies in question.

Also, the carrot/onion study I cited before was only one of a whole body of research, all of which show that E coli (and the others) are very persistent in a wide variety of environments, and very potent once ingested.

Did they mention anything else on the drastic variability of survival between different crops?

 
Employees: employee movements in the field remains the #1 source of contamination. 

Also, I would expect, after the produce leaves the field.

 Oddly, the certified organic growers were the most annoyed even though they were already the closest to meeting the new recommendations. 

I can't speak for all organic growers; but suspect this may be because, on average, we are more used to thinking of the farm as an entire living system which contains, and should contain, many species. We may therefore be more likely to be upset about recommendations that equate health to sterility, and in particular about recommendations that amount to "there should be no mammalian or avian species anywhere near the crops".


 
Also, from a historical perspective, there is a lot of precedent for any new set of guidelines or recommendations to be met with much gnashing of teeth and predictions of "the end of things as we know them".  Yet that doom never materializes.  The meat and dairy sectors have already gone through this process, and small scale producers have weathered that transition in both sectors.  

Well, small scale dairy producers have been going out of business at a high rate of speed for many years now. What percentage of the problem has been caused by increasing regulations is hard to determine -- at least, I just spent rather too long on Google not getting very far  -- but I've certainly been told, by older farmers in New York State, that many of the farms that went out of dairy, and/or out of business altogether, during the 1950's and 1960's did so because they couldn't keep up with increasingly strict regulations that required, not just that the milk be clean, but that it be made so by specific expensive technology.


-- Rivka; Finger Lakes NY, Zone 5 mostly
Fresh-market organic produce, small scale






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