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livingontheland - Re: [Livingontheland] John Warner, etc.

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Subject: Healthy soil and sustainable growing

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  • From: "E. E. Mitchamore Jr" <emitch@att.net>
  • To: "Healthy soil and sustainable growing" <livingontheland@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] John Warner, etc.
  • Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 18:20:08 -0500

One thing that I like about Warner is that he makes the connections between science and agricultural practice.  Many would have us believe that they are antithetical (maybe because science is so often used to do harm) but, in fact, science is useful as a method to describe and explain what we observe, as well as the limits of what we can do.  I had not seen his website before, either, and find it a useful presentation of the principles we are discussing.
 
Something I've learned this season is that squash is not well-behaved in a small "intensive" garden.  Visions of old Japanese horror movies........"The squash that ate my garden".  The vines have crawled through the fence and started up the sunflower stalks 10' away (which are currently about 7' tall).
 
I just received the first copy of "Edible Austin" http://www.edibleaustin.com/ .  It's a bit fancy, but well done.  Other cities have their own "Edible" magazines, and they can be useful for identifying resources and opportunities.
 
E. E. "Mitch" Mitchamore
www.hillcountrynatives.biz
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Livingontheland] John Warner


I'm not at all impressed with Warner, but as I said I do agree about using
outside sources for compost or mulch - but not because Jeavons' has a
"closed system"; it's not a closed system. While Jeavons showed it can be
done without outside sources, I don't recall him claiming everybody had to
do it that way and send all our society's waste to the landfill. Same with
double digging. He showed what could be done with very small garden spaces,
but we know that in many places building up is more realistic than digging
down. And we've learned how we can avoid repeated annual digging, with
no-till techniques. Jeavons' contribution is immensely important in regard
to high production from intensive beds, but not the last word. Ruth Stout
made a sea change in mulch gardening but she didn't have the last word.
Even Warner has shown what can be done for a market garden without power
equipment. So I have to be skeptical about relying on a single garden
expert for all my information, and stay open minded. This year I've set up
the garden for no-till for the first time, combining intensive beds with
season extension for market. Still learning - of course.  Which is a good
reason for a list like this ;-)

paul tradingpost@lobo.net

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 6/4/2007 at 9:28 AM Ken Hargesheimer wrote:

>Douglas ,
>  
>  Thanks for posting that.  In my years of teaching I have never heard of
>John's work.  I cannot believe this. 
>  
>  He is 100% correct but I do not have the technical expertice John has as
>my degree is animal husbandry but I grew up on a farm.  When a writer says
>anything negative about John Jeavons, you better dodge the darts.  I have
>experienced that.  I took his course in 1997 but I stopped teaching double
>digging, etc. about 2000. 
>  
>  Ken Hargesheimer
>  



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