Homestead mailing list

[Rob <becida AT comcast.net>]

Here are some Tvo posts where he talks about tractors. Hope this helps.

Rob
becida AT comcast.net
Western Washington State
````````````````````````````

ate: Tue, 11 Apr 2000 13:28:13 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Griping again... GRRRRR
List-Unsubscribe:



farmer wrote:

>     I think it is time to declare open season on
> "buyers" that sit behind a desk and buy without
> knowing piddly about what they are doing.
>     Seems that with 2 farm stores in Shelbyville,
> In. CT and Big Blue (an Indiana chain) that

> neither sees a need to carry an oil filter for a
> Deere 4020.

Tvoivozhd---you've got a 4020?  That has got to be the best tractor of all 
time
if you need more horsepower than the 8N, T030 yard-scratchers.
````````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:15:02 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Mower and tractor questions
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>



Dan Settles wrote:

> My 1010 does not have a live PTO.
> I don't know if they made any that way.
>
> Dan

Tvoivozhd---You can cobble up a live PTO on those 
that were manufactured without
them.  Surplus Center (Used to be Burden Sales), 1015 West "O" Street, P.O Box
82209, Lincoln, NE 68501-2209, 1-800-488-3407, 
has a Danfoss PTO drive motor, Item
#9-5142 for $289.99 which will handle up to 28 hp.  The PTO shaft is 1 3/8" 6 
T
spline.  Use a variable-displacement pump to drive it, also obtainable from
Surplus Center You have to operate the pump at 
near-maximum though and make sure
your equipment does not require the less-common 1000 rpm.
Max capacity in this motor is 560 rpm.  This is what China Diesel does on its
little $5995 four-wheel drive tractors.
``````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
From: "tvoivozhd" <tvoivozd AT infi.net>
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: compressed earth block
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:30:47 -0800
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>


> By the way, my "new" tractor is a JD 4020.  It has more horsepower than
> I really planned on getting, but it was about the same price as some
> smaller tractors I was looking at.  I've heard you and others say such
> good things about the 4020 that I decided I might as well have one
> myself.  So far I like it, but its a wee bit bigger than the 1010.  I
> have to be careful not to knock down buildings when I use it.
>
> Dan

tvoivozhd---great.  The 4020 was (is) one of the truly great tractors.  The
only way you can wear it out or (maybe) stop it from running forever is to
throw sand in all the bearings.  To be more sure you might have to add some
varnish and epoxy.

`````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Tue, 04 Apr 2000 20:09:45 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: sickle bar mowers
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>

Tvoivozhd---Ariens is one of a handful (small handful) of good brands.  Lawn
tractors, good and bad are vastly overpriced in comparison with their
agricultural big brothers, which will be running 
well twenty years down the line
when the lawn tractors are landfill.

It is within the price range for lawn tractors, 
but I have a Massey with a front
end loader, bale spike, cab (no doors) and roll-over bar, 90% tires, plus new
clutches, brakes and power-steering motor, the cost is roughly the same.
Of course, some time was spent looking for it---and I used organic lawnmowers
(calves) and expect to do so again in a few weeks.

There are innumerable Ford 8N's, Ferguson or 
Massey Ferguson 20's, 30's and 35's
in good condition for less money.  Use some of the savings to hire a tractor
mechanic to come along and look at it.
````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2000 20:04:23 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: MF tractors
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>



Dan Settles wrote:

> Anyone know the difference between a MF 175 and a MF 180?  I've seen the
> 175, but have never seen a 180.  I looked up some information on a new
> site (to me):
>
> http://www.tractortips.com/make_model/makes.html
>
> Its a pretty nice site, but the specs for these tractors look almost
> identical.  Built at the same time, same horsepower, different tires
> maybe?  If anyone can give me some additional information I'd appreciate
> it.  Still looking at tractors.
>
> Dan Settles
>
> Tvoivozhd---you wouldn't notice the difference between the two.  But unless
> you have land flat as a pancake don't buy one with "Multipower"---unless you
> are careful, the tractor will free-wheel going downhill and the load will
> control you rather than vice-versa.  The later 
models may have been improved,
> but those of the 1970's with Multipower (shift without depressing clutch
> pedal) are dangerous---and good for $600 dollars a year repair bill on the
> Multipower.

```````````````
Date:   Thu, 25 Feb 1999 19:26:03 -0500
Reply-To: homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
Sender: owner-homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
From: Tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
To: homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
Subject: Re: China Diesel Imports - tractor Q's
References: <02dd01be60e7$816563d0$f5d94fc6 AT windsong.net2.nlu.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
X-Orcpt: rfc822;homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN



Spock Account wrote:

> > >>>tvoivozhd:  Last time I corresponded with them (several years ago) the
> > tractor did not have a live pto.
>
> I have seen this a lot on this list: What is a pto?

tvoivozhd---a "power take off.  The shaft sticking out the rear axle
differential housing.  It is for powering equipment such as mowers, bush hogs,
haybalers, concrete mixers, emergency generators etc..

If the tractor does not have a "live" power takeoff , and you are pulling a 
hay
baler, the shaft turns only when the tractor is moving---you do not have the
opportunity to get the machine up to speed prior to it being subject to
load---very hard on everything.

A live power takeoff permits you to run equipment while the tractor is 
stopped,
such as the aforesaid concrete mixer, emergency generator.  It also permits 
you
to get a hay baler bush hog etc. to get up to operating speed before you start
feeding in hay or cutting heavy brush.

````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 15:39:09 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Wives and rusty iron and patience... :-)  long, may be O.T.
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>

Grandad wrote:

> > .  Wonder when the
> > tiny Italian and Swiss round balers will become a collector's item.
> What size bales do these balers make?
> --
> >From mailto:grandad AT grandadsfarm.com and
> the Home of Grandad's Farm Magazine
> in the beautiful suburbs of Columbia, Missouri
> http://www.grandadsfarm.com/
>
> ---
> You are currently subscribed to homestead as: tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net
> To unsubscribe send a blank email to 
leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu

tvoivozhd---fifty to seventy pounds---up to the outside limit of one-person
handling them.  And a very small tractor to pull them---eighteen to thirty
horsepower is plenty, and you don't need hydraulics, drive them from the PTO.
They make eighty to one hundred twenty bales per hour.
 http://agriquip.com/
http://agriquip.com/mrb0840.html

The above company also makes disc-mowers and drum-mowers, not like a discbine
though, no stem rollers.
```````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2000 07:54:09 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Small farm tractors and basic equipment(was buckwheat)
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>



Don Bowen wrote:

> At 08:27 PM 8/10/2000 , you wrote:
> >tvoivozhd wrote:
> > >
> > > (b) The next in priority, and maybe the first, is a front-end
> > loader.  If you
> > > haven't used one, you won't realize this, but
> > > after using it, you will think seriously about trading your eldest
> > child for
> > > one.
>
> Be sure to get a tractor that can handle a front end loader.  Older
> tractors were not designed with the heavy front ends needed.  Usually
> anything built after the late fifties will have a stronger front.
>
> Don Bowen                       donb AT cts.com
> Valley Center, CA               Senior Software Engineer
> Internet development and software engineering

Tvoivozhd---I used an 8N in the early 1950's in the building business for
running a hydraulic pump which powered a guillotine making "split rock" from
ribbons of concrete for siding, and used its front end loader for cleanup,
landscaping, lifting shingles to the roof etc.  I welded up a heavier front
front end, attaching heavier spindles and larger 
tires.  Should have added power
steering, especially on soft ground.  Incidentally, tractor, front end loader
and concrete siding equipment all together then cost $1700---all in like new
condition.

````````````````
Date:   Thu, 25 Feb 1999 08:48:12 -0500
Reply-To: homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
Sender: owner-homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
From: Tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
To: homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
Subject: Re: China Diesel Imports - tractor Q's
References: <36D4CC4D.CE149FF0 AT yonderway.com>
X-Accept-Language: en
X-Orcpt: rfc822;homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN



Chris Hedemark wrote:

> Y'all have seen those tractors on the back cover of Countryside
> magazine, I'm sure, selling new for $5995.95.  This isn't much at all
> considering what the new tractors are selling for, also comparing to
> some 25+ year old models for sale in the paper.
>
> Does anyone have personal experience or know someone directly with
> firsthand experience on these?
>
> I was going to take my chances with a WWII-era tractor because I thought
> that's all I could afford but if these Chinese tractors are any good
> I'll save up longer.
>
> Also, I don't know squat about farm machinery... are attachments
> interchangeable between tractor makes & models?  That is, can I go rent
> a backhoe attachment or a post hole digger attachment and hitch it onto
> this thing?
>
> --
>
> Chris Hedemark
> Email: chris AT yonderway.com   ICQ: 28986378
> Rural Living at Yonder Way - http://www.yonderway.com/rural

>>>tvoivozhd:  Last time I corresponded with them (several years ago) the
tractor did not have a live pto.  I think they had some sort of cobbled--up
substitute they were going to install themselves as an option, perhaps a
hydraulic engine-pump and motor at the rear, but you'd better check on it
before you spend any monty.  The rest of the tractor should be pretty
reliable.
```````````````
NOTE--[Lot's of URL's in this one, it's old so the best of luck to you]

Date:   Thu, 04 Mar 1999 12:20:21 -0500
Reply-To: homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
Sender: owner-homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
From: Tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
To: homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
Subject: Price comparison, sources for tractors, farm & garden equipment
References: <36DEA8DA.85F85979 AT metaphasetech.com>
X-Accept-Language: en
X-Orcpt: rfc822;homestead AT listserv.oit.unc.edu
X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.1 -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN

>>>tvoivozhd---I had all this neatly classified and described but hit the
wrong right click and lost it---had to go back in the clipboard cache to
find it again, but without the descriptions.
Anyway, probably everything you need for price comparison on your tractors,
and present items for sale is below.  Toward the bottom of the list of URL's
there are probably some which do not relate to your topic.  It's a rum go,
but you'll have to slog through to find out.

http://www.agr.state.ga.us/mbsite/html/ads.html
http://www.agr.state.nc.us/paffairs/class/octequip.htm
http://www.the-guide.com/html/fe.htm
http://101industrial.com/classified/transportation/messages/2.html
http://www.americanfarmer.com/classifieds/farm_equipment.html
http://www.agquip.com/html/viewads.html
http://www.agquip.com/cgi-bin/classifieds/view.cgi
http://www.bickcom.net/Tractorville/tracboard/wwwboard/index.html
http://www.fastfinder.com/
http://www.cafe.com.my/classifiedlinks.html
http://newmexicoranch.com/ag-page/farm-equipment/index.htm
http://farmersadvance.com/
http://www.hpj.com/
http://www.hpj.com/wsdocs/edit1/0222hogfarmwinsMR.htm
http://www.agriculture.com/topshops/webfeatures/gadget/index.html
http://www.agriculture.com/class_ads/index.shtml
http://www.nafb.com/
http://www.nafb.com/toolslinks.htm
http://www.fastlinepub.com/f_publications.asp

``````````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 15:20:17 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Small farm tractors and basic equipment(was buckwheat)
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>



Don Bowen wrote:

>
> That's OK, older John Deeres are not real tractors anyway.  They were an
> obsolete design from the beginning and did modernize until the late fifties.
>
> Collectors have driven up prices to ridiculous levels so anything green and
> yellow will go for many times its real value and the smaller the higher
> priced.  I saw a two axle trailer that had been painted green and yellow go
> for about twice what it cost from the dealer about 5 miles away.  I am
> thinking of building one to sell.
>
> Don Bowen                       donb AT cts.com
> Valley Center, CA               Senior Software Engineer
> Internet development and software engineering

Tvoivozhd---yeah, a 420 John Deere came with this 
place---engine shot because they
let it freeze.  I sold it for $300 to a friend 
who stuffed a good engine in it and
made it look like  new.  I didn't like the 
fragile rear wheel reductions and would
not have repaired it myself.  I don't think the previous owners enjoyed it 
much
either, there were several such wheel reductions 
scattered in various sheds, all
with broken gear housings. One or two of those is the price of a complete
tractor.  There was an articulated-blade bush hog 
with a 45 hp gearbox here also,
and a solid driveshaft (no overriding  clutch)  I 
shudder to think what that would
do to that poor little old 420 or any of the smaller tractors.

```````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Sun, 04 Jun 2000 16:18:58 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: MF tractors
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>



Dan Settles wrote:

> So if I make the mistake of starting down a hill in low and start
> freewheeling, can I shift back into high to have the engine slow the
> tractor?

Tvoivozhd---don't even think about it.  You may try it when the tractor is
already on the verge of going out of control---under such circumstances
the best you can do is to try to keep it going straight downhill and not jack
knife.  Better yet, never, never buy a 1970's MF with Multipower unless
it is to be used exclusively on flat land.

>
>
> There is a tractor shop near us that buys old MF tractors, rebuilds them
> and sells them.  They do good work, but the prices are very high.  I
> have been told that they remove the Multipower when they rebuild them.
> Do you know if this can be done easily or cheaply as an alternative to
> yearly repairs?  Is there something about hill country that causes
> excessive wear to the multipower that would not be seen on flat land?
> Thanks for all your advice!
>
> Dan

Tvoivozhd---Most rebuilders remove the 
Multipower---primarily to relieve themselves of
a warranty burden.
Removal is necessary to avoid yearly repairs to 
the Multipower.  Normally you only
have to repair brakes and clutches every five 
years or so under heavy use.  In your
usage you may never have to repair them in your 
lifetime---assuming they were in good
condition to start with.

Hill country service is more severe than flatland 
service on all tractor components.

```````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Sun, 04 Jun 2000 08:03:48 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: MF tractors
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>

>
> I've looked at some tractors with Multipower.  A man near me has a MF
> 165 for sale that has it.  He said he loves it.  I talked with a guy
> with a MF 175 who said he doesn't use it much, but he said the tractor
> could free-wheel down a hill if you shifted into low.  I don't
> understand how this works, but I got the impression that it didn't
> happen if the tractor was in high.  I saw the same thing on a JD 2630.
>
> So does your MF 175 have Multipower, or did you remove it?
>
> Dan

Tvoivozhd---the first guy is lying or has flat land.  The second guy is
right---you don't want to go downhill in high 
with a big load behind you and you
don't want to freewheel down hill.  I have a neighbor with a 1970's MF 180.
It's been sitting in his machine shed for four years now.  His hayfields are
very steep. I and other friends told him not to buy it, but he had to find out
for himself that it could kill him.  Expensive lesson, especially since he
overpaid for it and the transmission is badly 
worn.  Fine engine, though sitting
for four years may do it in.



My 175 does not have multipower.  When running under heavy, continuous load on
flat land, Multipower is a convenience, since shifting occurs much more 
rapidly
and you can quickly match the gear to the load as soil or small changes in
terrain dictate.  In hill country repair cost on Multipower alone is
excessive--another neighbor who does custom work 
with his 165 spends $600 a year
to repair the Multipower.  I regard this as a total waste.

I'm not absolutely certain, but most John Deeres 
and Fords with a shuttle should
not have this defect, nor should MF machines built in 1980's and newer.  I'd
want to trly one before I bought it though.
````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2000 09:29:16 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: tractors
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>

erthnsky AT bellsouth.net wrote:

> What can you guys tell me about Mahindra tractors?  I know that Case IH
> is associated with them and that IH helped developed them in the '60 in
> India, I think.  I read that about 75% of IH parts will fit Mahindra
> tractors.  What else do I need to know about this brand?
>
> B
> --
> erthnsky AT bellsouth.net
> Bevanron of EarthNSky Farm and Horizon Caprines
> http://earthnsky.50megs.com/
> 34.469° N   85.082°W    NW Georgia USA  USDA Zone 7

Tvoivozhd---the most important thing you need to know is how expert, reliable,
responsible is your Mahindra dealer.  He should be reasonably close.  Part of
the reliability factor is does he have a good parts stock so you don't have to
wait forever.

The Mahindra is a good, solid tractor, both 
because of its IH and Case heritage,
and the fact that Indian farmers don't have money for anything that needs 
early
replacement or constant repair---and Indian Engineers are among the world's
best, it has been the stratification of society and capital that has held the
country back.

It is, for example, a much better tractor than the on-the-surface competent
Belarus, which Russians were compelled to buy for decades.  You are playing
BelaRussian roulette buying one of them.  Some are very good, a lot are very
bad, and the best have leaky hydraulics and 
hellaciously hard to get parts.  The
problem with Mahindra is simply scarcity of dealers.

Always get the warranty in writing too.  Part of 
the dealer reputation is how he
views warranty.  A good dealer will go beyond 
factory warranty if the factory is
unreasonable.  It often is.  If you read Farm Show there is a section on
equipment dealers and manufacturer's attitude toward warranty repair.  It is
enlightening---a little frightening in fact to see how some manufacturers 
stick
it to their customers.  Lemon laws apply only to automobiles.

`````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 19:27:20 -0500
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Greetings from Goose Creek
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>



FranksFarm AT aol.com wrote:

>
> Around here used tractors 20 years old often sell for almost the cost of a
> new tractor! So since I have only recently driven a tractor I feel it is far
> better to buy a new one with a warranty. Too easy to get stuck buying used.

Tvoivozhd---If you are not a mechanic or don't 
have a buddy next door who is, and
who knows how to check out all the systems for 
wear, a new tractor is less risky,
though it consumes a lot of capital.  A Kubota is 
a very good machine,  I am not
familiar with the model---in my opinion a four wheel drive is well worth the
added cost if your hills are like my hills, and 
70 hp is sufficient for anything
you are apt to pull---like a round baler.  Never, 
never get a Massey round baler
though.  New Holland, John Deere and Gehl are generally good---start a bale
quickly and make a tight one which sheds water well.

>
>
> Sure could have used TVO's advice in building this new house. I started out
> with the intention of building an energy effecient, low maintenance , non
> toxic home. But I can tell you it is very difficult to get " straight
> answers" from the experts, and some of these systems proved a bit too costly
> for my budget of ca $50 a sq ft or less. I'll 
need lots of sweat equity to do
> it though:)
>
> Initially I had planned on metal roof...and after months of debating
> alternative materials I'm back to metal roof. 
I also found out that there can
> be a big difference in quality of the metal roofing offered. I thought they
> were all the same...dummy. No one down here ever seemed to ask questions
> about the painting system, the thickness of 29 guage metal, the amount of
> zinc etc.

tvoivozhd---I like a heavier gage than 29, my minimum would be 26, and my
preference is galvanized plus paint, either factory paint or my own.  After
fifteen or twenty years it will be your own paint---applied every five to 
seven
years the roof will outlast your great, great grandchildren.

>
>
> Low price was prime consideration. many folks buy #2 grade which in my area
> is about $33 a square vs $43 for #1 quality 
which may have a 20 year warranty
> on paint and metal failures. I'm told #2 is often actually made with cheaper
> materials, and paint and doesn't hold up as well. I thought they were the
> same as #1 but with some slight defects. Apparently this is not necessarily
> so. So I'd rather be safe than sorry and will go with #1.
>
```````````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 13:31:48 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Mower and tractor questions
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>

> .
>
> Sounds like about the right size for me.  I'd like to get a diesel with
> around 60 hp, a live pto, power steering and hopefully some roll over
> protection so I won't kill myself if I make a mistake.
> We have only MF and JD dealers around here.  The MF's are usually
> cheaper, but most of the farmers I talk to say to pay extra for the
> green color because you get it back in resale.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dan Settles

Tvoivozhd---yeah, 55 hp is minimum to pull a 
round baler without strain, and 60 would
be better---allowing for loss of horsepower 
across the years.  I think the 1972 MF 175
is 62 hp.

We have JD, MF, Ford dealers here, plus some of 
the Japanese, Indian, Chinese and
Russian U.S. brand subcontractors.  I don't need and wouldn't pay for a new
one---though if I were younger I'd go for a new 
four-wheel-drive.  When the MF showed
up, I was actually looking for a Ford 4000, which would be my two-wheel-drive
preference in hill country.

Our previous tractor was a small John 
Deere.  They do bring more on resale, but cost
more on purchase so at best it's a wash if you 
don't regard more money tied up as a
cost.  They are not more capable than their Case, 
MF or Ford counterparts.  A good
honest service facility that warrants their work 
without reservation is of primary
importance.  If they are competent in more than 
one brand, it gives you more latitude
in purchase.

Rollover protection is supremely important.  I 
would not operate a tractor without
it.  A few things to watch for---I ran a 245 
Massey for a couple years.  The power
steering reservoir was not large enough to 
maintain proper operation, whereas the
older 1972 MF 175 is a joy to use.  Look closely 
at the seat on whatever tractor you
use---it may save you a trip to the hospital and 
several fingers.  Be sure the seat
does not descend so far in use that it will smash 
fingers between seat and cast-iron
frame when you are reaching for a lever without 
looking---no, don't look, it's better
to see where the tractor and you are going at all 
times.  A Massey peculiarity is that
the pressure-regulator (under your legs, adjacent to the seat) "O"-rings need
replacement every two or three years.  You will 
know when---if your three-point lift
sl-o-o-o-w-ly subsides instead of staying where 
you want it.  Cheap repair, a couple
of bucks and twenty minutes if you do it yourself.  Maybe fifty bucks at a
dealer---more if he is dishonest.
`````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2000 11:36:01 -0400
From: tvoivozhd <tvoivozd AT roanoke.infi.net>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Small farm tractors and basic equipment(was buckwheat)
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>

>
> You mentioned several implements, but not my favorite: the box
> blade.  For a few hundred bucks, it gives you the capacity to move
> great quantities of earth (though slowly, compared to a dozer).  I
> use it to build and maintain roadways, smooth land or shape it for
> better drainage, strip topsoil from building sites and spread
> gravel, even dig small ponds.  Mine has six scarifiers that can be
> adjusted for digging or smoothing.  The box blade also makes a good
> counterweight when I'm using the loader on heavy materials as it
> helps provide better traction.  Maybe it's just the kind of things I
> like to do with a tractor, but I use my box blade more than any
> other implement.
>
> Doug

Tvoivozhd---yup a box blade is a good gadget---I used one for a long time to
haul huge blocks of wood from way back in the woods and steep terrain where a
truck would be useless---so steep I had to back up instead of going
forward to prevent the front end from rotating on top of me.  The scarifiers
double its utility.  I was using a Massey
245 in the woods.  My Massey 175 Industrial is too big and clumsy for that,
though I get in the forest edges to
take out wood with the front end loader.

A specialized gadget is a subsoil chisel for breaking up hardpan caused by
decades of using a moldboard plow.
You only have to use it once, after which the 
deep roots of legumes like alfalfa
keep the soil friable and migration of moisture up and down unimpeded.  When I
needed it for a couple fields, I borrowed it from a friend who has everything
you would like to have but can't justify the cost on a small place.  He writes
it off against his machine shop and haymaking business, but as a fellow
machine-maniac, he would buy his bulldozers, backhoes, huge air compressors,
concrete mixer, rockpicker, haybine anyway.  I tried to talk him out of the
haybine---told him that if he was going to spend that kind of money on new
machines, he ought to put two or three thousand with it and get a diskbine for
its vastly greater utility. His 580 Case loader/backhoe on rubber tires is a
killer on hills though---I watched him skid down a hill at high speed, 
bouncing
four feet in the air as he hit bumps or rocks.  I don't know how he survived
that one.  A loader/backhoe is very useful, but in hill country should be a
track loader, not on wobbly,
skid-prone rubber.  I used a 580 on rubber for a long time digging for gunite
pools, but only on level ground.
````````````````
Return-Path: <bounce-homestead-227727 AT listserv.unc.edu>
From: "tvoivozhd" <tvoivozd AT infi.net>
To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: tractor question
Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 12:42:22 -0700
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:leave-homestead-227727P AT listserv.unc.edu>
Reply-To: "Homestead mailing list" <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>


----- Original Message -----
From: Randy Bullard <ranlan AT jscomm.net>
To: Homestead mailing list <homestead AT listserv.unc.edu>
Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 7:46 PM
Subject: tractor question


Can anyone give me an idea of what a 54hp, Ford 4600 tractor with 3000
hours, tires in fair condition, kept shedded  and it's and 79 model is
worth.  Any information would be appreciated!

Randy Bullard


tvoivozhd---with so many e-mails from just a few lists, sometimes you have
to post a question two or three times.  It slipped by me until Rob
responded.

Good condition, with a front end loader, about $12,000.  With 4000 hours it
can be in good condition if will maintained---but may have been subjected to
windblown sand, constant, heavy loads, high-impact loads about which you
cannot be well-informed. Nothing takes the place of an expert mechanic on
Ford tractors, performing all necessary tests on engine, clutches, brakes,
transmission, rear-end, wheel bearings, steering etc.
http://www.montgomerytractor.com/Used_Tractors/body_used_tractors.html

http://www.schlofmantractor.com/used.htm#Tractors  (comparable, but not
4600's)

http://www.wisfarmer.com/clas0002.html  (more tractor miscellany)

http://www.agr.state.nc.us/paffairs/class/3-01equip.htm  (couple 4600's
here, with equipment, call and separate out equipment to ascertain tractor
price)

http://atlnet11.agr.state.ga.us/mbads/ads/current/Farm_Machinery.html
(another used farm machinery list---there are dozens of them, a lot
reachable only through the ag magazines and ag search engines)

Sometimes the local trader publications such as thriftynickel.com can be
searched for the answer you are looking for---and all tractor repair dealers
that buy and sell tractors, have a trade book that lists the average
wholesale and retail value of all common tractor brands.

I just sold a Massey 175 with a front end loader, 4200 total hours on
hour-meter, with about fifteen hours on new clutches, new brakes, new
hydraulic steering pump, at least 80% rubber, and with unmounted rollbar,
plus a cab I hated and would never put back on.  Priced it at $6750, which
almost exactly corresponded with retail book value at the repair shop who
did some of the work---except book value does not accurately reflect value
of new parts installed so recently.  It sold within twenty four hours of
placing the ad in the local trader publication  The engine had been
overhauled, probably within the past 1000 hours, but I had no documentation
of it.  Forgot---sold it for $6500 cash.
`````````````````````
This ought to be enough for now...