Skip to Content.
Sympa Menu

community_studios - Re: [Community_studios] Need help from the expert

community_studios AT lists.ibiblio.org

Subject: Discussion of all things related to Public Domain

List archive

Chronological Thread  
  • From: "tompoe AT renonevada.net" <tompoe AT renonevada.net>
  • To: Kevin Marks <kmarks AT mac.com>
  • Cc: "beSpacific.com" <bespacific AT earthlink.net>, community_studios AT lists.ibiblio.org, Lawrence Lessig <lessig AT pobox.com>
  • Subject: Re: [Community_studios] Need help from the expert
  • Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 09:16:05 -0800

Hi, Kevin: Remarkable! Isn't that the ideal legislative intent example folks always look for? I think so. Thank you very much.

The earth is for the living, not the dead. Sounds disrespectful of the dead at first blush, but life is harsh, eh?

Well, with this exciting news [to me and my feeble brain], it's on with the logic. Assuming there's no conflict in anyone's mind that the intent of the founding fathers of our country was to grant monopolies for the lifetime of the creator, then, the dissension is restricted by logic to those who would try and justify moving away from that intent, to not grant monopolies beyond the creators' lifetime. My impression is that the greedy ones now want to extend beyond the lifetime of the creator, simply because they want to provide for their heirs. Compelling? Who knows?!

So, with that in mind, we then can leave those greedy souls to their lot, and develop an infrastructure that provides a choice for people. Kevin puts forth a Digital Age economy built around commissions [I hope that is close]. The Creative Commons Project puts forth a legal framework to carry on activities within a Democracy and Civil Society in the Digital Age. Open Studios puts forth community-based recording studios for all local residents to use without charge, thus enabling all citizens to engage in business, whether for creating music, art, manufacturing, marketing, etc., in the Digital Age. We still need healthcare to move into the Digital Age. I suspect that will happen when the science of nanotechnology reaches a point that requires all treatments for health to be tailored to the individual [I'm basically making reference to clinical research, here, which leads to treatment plans for individuals. The present research system relies on sampling \groups within a population]. When that happens, individuals will be empowered to seek healthcare on an individual basis, and the picture will change dramatically [I hope].

In the meantime, we have enough pieces to begin to develop a compelling argument for moving forward with a Digital Age vs. Information Age competition. Us or them. See you soon, while I rest my feeble brain.
Thanks,
Tom Poe
Open Studios
Reno, NV

Kevin Marks wrote:

On Tuesday, February 4, 2003, at 08:57 PM, tompoe AT renonevada.net wrote:

Hi, Sabrina: Here's my question.

What search terms would you use to learn more about copyright terms? Specifically, I'm interested in finding out who might have thought about copyright terms in a relative sense to the "life expectancy" consideration for those who lived in the 1790's. The life expectancy span at that time, was something in the range of 36 years. Noting that, then, it might seem logical to attach a related term of "lifetime" to the then, 14 year copyright plus renewal, which took it to 28 years. This would coincide with an accepted philosophy of granting copyright for the life of the creator, even in the 1790's.


You're on the right track - Jefferson discussed this with Madison on exactly this basis:
http://digital.library.upenn.edu/books/bplist/archive/1999-02-11$2.html

Jefferson's own preference for the term of copyright was communi-
cated to Madison a few days afterward, in a letter of September 6,
1789. There he proposed a term of 19 years, based on an actuarial
calculation:

The question Whether one generation of men has
a right to bind another seems never to have
been started on this [i.e., the European side --
Jefferson was writing from France] or our [American]
side of the water... that no such obligation can
be so transmitted I think very capable of proof. --
I set out on this ground, which I suppose to be
self evident, that the earth belongs in usufruct
to the living; that the dead have neither powers
nor rights over it... A generation coming in and
going out entire... would have a right on the first
year of their self-dominion to contract a debt
for 33 years, in the 10th for 24, in the 20th for
14, in the 30th for 4, whereas generations, changing
daily by daily deaths and births, have one constant
term, beginning at the date of their contract, and
ending when a majority of those of full age at that
date shall be dead. The length of that term may
be estimated from the tables of mortality. Take,
for instance, the tables of M. de Buffon...
[according to which] half of those of 21 years [of
age] and upwards living at any one instant of time will
be dead in 18 years 8 months, or say 19 years as the
nearest integral number. Then 19 years is the term
beyond which neither the representatives of a nation,
nor even the whole nation itself assembled, can validly
extend a debt... This principle that the earth belongs
to the living, and not to the dead, is of very extensive
application... Turn this subject in your mind, my
dear Sir... Your station in the councils of our country
gives you an opportunity for producing it to public
consideration... Establish the principle... in the
new law to be passed for protecting copyrights and new
inventions, by securing the exclusive right for 19
instead of 14 years.

If this argument were put forth, and it was with merit, then the discussion over copyright would take on a different flavor, at least for me. But, so far, I haven't seen much discussion on this with the searches I have done, or the readings I have been exposed to. Are you able to offer any suggestions? My interest is in trying to move the discussion away from fighting with corporate idiots, and moving on to solutions [such as Open Studios/Creative Commons, hint, hint].


not to mention mediAgora:

------------------------------
http://mediagora.com - encourage copying, receive payment, reward sales




--
http://www.studioforrecording.org/
"There is no Public Domain unless we do it ourselves"
--
Please go to EFF.org page at http://www.eff.org
and register for the TAKE ACTION page.
If you can donate $5 to them, that'll help, too
--





Archive powered by MHonArc 2.6.24.

Top of Page