Biblical Hebrew Forum

[K Randolph <kwrandolph AT gmail.com>]

Dear Robert:

On Thu, May 3, 2012 at 7:44 AM, Robert D. Rachlin <rrachlin AT drm.com> wrote:

>  Dear Karl,****
>
> ** **
>
> Your thoughtful comments propel me back to the books.
>

Discussions on this list often send me back to my books, and even when I’m
wrong, I learn from the discussion. There are also many times where we must
simply agree to disagree, admitting that Biblical Hebrew language is not as
well known as some of us would like it to be.

> ****
>
> ** **
>
> Although the two are related, I’d mention first that my comments were not
> on הבה HBH, which you address, but on יהב  YHB.
>

The dictionaries I consulted considered הבה HBH as a derivative of יהב YHB.
I am now formally challenging that.


> Leave Strong aside.  Davidson explicates the root YHB as both a verb and
> as a noun “which some take as a verb,” and he refers specifically to Psalms
> 55:23.  As a noun, Davidson (1848) has “burden, trouble.”
>

I had Davidson’t Analytical Lexicon, reprints still available at Amazon. I
used my copy until it fell apart from use. I learned a lot from it.

However, there were a few problems with it. While I learned roots and
derivations from it, there were many times it left me scratching my head in
bafflement as to how Davidson could have derived certain words from their
supposed roots (one reason I so oppose the “etymological error” today).
Secondly, he listed the forms according to a grammatical formula that is
wrong for Biblical Hebrew. Thirdly, while definitions were generally in the
ball park, in comparing those definitions against actual uses as found in a
Hebrew concordance, they were sometimes off. I suspect that his definitions
were consistent with Mishnaic to medieval Hebrew. Fourthly, he did not
question the Masoretic points. While I acknowledge that the vast majority
of the points are correct as far as meaning is concerned, they are wrong
often enough that in difficult to read passages, usually wrong pointing is
the culprit.


>   Jastrow (1967) recognizes the noun as “bundle, load on the back,” but
> recognizes its origin from the verb, i.e., “that which is put on.”  Klein
> also recognizes YHB as a noun meaning “load,  burden,” but gives its
> derivation as from the verb.  Klein also notes that the nominal form is a
> hapax legomenon, occurring only at Psalms 55:23.  However, I must
> acknowledge that Mandelkern, in his Hebrew concordance (1896), gives 
> יהבךYHBK, followed by a question mark, as a third person verb with a suffix.
> But he also gives יהב  YHB and יהבך YHBK as a noun, again followed by a
> question mark in the former case.  His translation is “onus, met. cura,
> sors.” He treats השלך H$LK as a verb in the imperative mood.
>

I don’t have personal knowledge of Jastrow’s, Klein’s or Mandelkern’s
writings and why they made the conclusions they made, so I can’t comment on
them.

> ****
>
> ** **
>
> With respect to שלה $LH and your suggestion that the Masoretic points be
> ignored and the possibility that השלך H$LK is in fact a noun with the
> definite article and the second person singular enclitic, I wonder whether
> we don’t have to construe the phrase rather tortuously in order to
> accommodate this reading.  If we treat the root as שלה $LH, i.e., a
> peacemaker, and יהב YHB as a verb, we end up with something like “Your
> peacemaker will give/put you upon Adonai, and He will sustain you.”
>

Where do you get the idea that של $L means “peacemaker”? I have never seen
it so used. Rather I have seen it used to refer to confidence; often in a
negative sense of overconfidence, not giving the proper honor and respect.

> ****
>
> ** **
>
> Your prosodic point about looking for a parallel construction in the
> following phrase, which contains the Yiqtol form יכלכלך YKLKLK is
> interesting.  You suggest, on this basis, that יהבך  YHBK should,
> therefore, also be read as a Yiqtol verb.  As we all know,  parallelism is
> common in the Psalms, but it is neither uniform nor inevitable.
>

True, but at the same time not to be ignored.

> ****
>
> ** **
>
> My fundamental objection to your reading of יהבך YHBK as a verb is that
> it forces us to treat השלך H$LK as a noun, with a resultant reading that,
> to me at least, makes little sense.
>

“Your confidence upon YHWH will bring you forward that he will provide for
you.”

Seems to make sense to me.

I was having difficulty with the idea of throwing down, usually used in the
sense of onto the ground or in a pit, in a destructive and disdainful
action. I was also having trouble relating יהב YHB with its supposed uses
in Genesis 29:21, 30:1, 47:15 and other verses and connecting it with Psalm
55:23.

One way out is to admit that יהב YHB is a happax legomenon with a meaning
that is distinct from הבה HBH, which is the way I understand you are taking.

> ****
>
> ** **
>
> That the translators of the NKJV and the Lutherbibel  (“Wirf dein Anliegen
> auf den Herrn”) treat יהבך YHBK as a noun assuredly does not foreclose
> challenge.  The Talmudic and rabbinic traditions are replete with just such
> efforts to examine words and phrases with grammatical and denotative casts
> at variance with the conventional.  Still, in the absence of more
> convincing evidence, I’m inclined to retain my view that יהבך YHBK is not
> a Yiqtol verb.
>

I view translation on a lower level than linguistic analysis. I never
consult translations when analyzing difficult passages.

> ****
>
> ** **
>
> Kind regards.****
>
> ** **
>
> Bob****
>
> [image: Description: http://www.drm.com/_gfx/DRM-blocks.gif]****
>
> *Robert D. Rachlin** **|** **Downs Rachlin Martin PLLC** *
> *Senior Director & General Counsel**
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>
> **
>

Yours, Karl W. Randolph.

> **
>
> **
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* K Randolph [mailto:kwrandolph AT gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 02, 2012 15:21
> *To:* Robert D. Rachlin
> *Cc:* b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
> *Subject:* Re: [b-hebrew] YHB in Psalms 55:23****
>
> ** **
>
> Dear Robert:****
>
> ** **
>
> Unfortunately for your answer, Strong was not a Hebrew scholar, and as
> such his words are not considered authoritative in discussing the text.
> Likewise, don’t rely on the Masoretic points, as they are wrong often
> enough so as to be untrustworthy.****
>
> ** **
>
> What you need to do is to analyse the context: is השלך H$LK from the
> root שלך $LK or a noun from the root שלה $LH with a second person singular
> possessive suffix? Should we not be looking for a verb with the same
> conjugation as the following phrase, יכלכלך YKLKLK, in other words a third
> person singular Yiqtol verb with a second person singular object suffix?**
> **
>
> ** **
>
> Now that you brought up a possible meaning, הבה HBH never has the meaning
> of “burden, lot or fate”, rather “to bring forth, go forth” with the action
> of coming out. This is after looking at more than 20 times that the verb is
> used.****
>
> ** **
>
> I look forward to your analysis.****
>
> ** **
>
> Karl W. Randolph.****
>
>
>