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  • From: dana densmore <danadensmore AT hotmail.com>
  • To: <b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: [b-hebrew] Sorting senses of $M(
  • Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2009 18:35:26 +0000


[b-hebrew] Sorting senses of $M(


George Athos requested that I repost this with a subject line (oops, sorry!)

Shalom, all.
I put out a query a couple weeks ago that didn't get any response, but I'm
still pondering the question and would still welcome your thoughts. Maybe
the question was too general, so let me narrow it to one example. I asked:


"One thing I'm wondering about is whether you all find in Tanakh a sense of
"listen" in the English meaning of active listening, not just passive
hearing, and distinguished from the use of "listen" as a synonym for "obey".
Does that sense appear in Tanakh, as you read it?

"For example, take the Ex.19:5 phrase )M $MW( T$M(W BQLY. Are we dealing
with "if you, listening, listen to my voice" / "If you really listen to my
voice" ? Or must we say "If you really hear my voice"? Or "If you really
obey my voice"? Hearing of course follows if we listen to a voice that is
there, and obedience should follow (and is implied by the following phrase,
"and guard my covenant"). But what activity is being described in the first
part of the protasis ("if" condition) of Ex 19:5?"


I mean this as a question about Biblical Hebrew, not theology. Can we, based
on the way we find the root used in the text, say something useful about the
semantic range of this word in Biblical Hebrew?
Thanks!
Dana Densmore


[b-hebrew] Sorting senses of $M(‏




From:


b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org on behalf of dana densmore
(danadensmore AT hotmail.com)




Sent:


Sun 4/12/09 3:55 AM




To:


b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org




Dear b-hebrew listers,




I'm hoping that some of you might be willing to help me with a question about
$M(.




I am wondering whether it is possible to get a first approximation
understanding of how to distinguish between the activities of hearing,
listening, and obeying, and some guidance in translation, possibly using
binyan and/or the presence of a following preposition---B:, L:, or )L.




Of course the context is the main determinant, and one must start by
carefully pondering that. But there are places where the context doesn't
unequivocally suggest a particular one of those senses, and interpretation
must come in. But a lot can seem to ride on those distinctions in the English
and one wants a translation that doesn't send folks (including onself)
galloping down the wrong road.




Of course those senses are inter-related and it's clear enough why the same
Hebrew word would cover that range. Indeed, the same overlap of sense is
there in those English words. But there are also at times significant
distinctions in meanings and connotations of the English words.




One thing I'm wondering about is whether you all find in Tanakh a sense of
"listen" in the English meaning of active listening, not just passive
hearing, and distinguished from the use of "listen" as a synonym for "obey".
Does that sense appear in Tanakh, as you read it?




For example, take the Ex.19:5 phrase )M $MW( T$M(W BQLY. Are we dealing with
"if you, listening, listen to my voice" / "If you really listen to my voice"
? Or "If you really hear my voice"? Or "If you really obey my voice"? I've
always leaned towards the first ("listen") in understanding this passage.
Hearing of course follows if we listen to a voice that is there, and
obedience should follow (and is implied by the following phrase, "and guard
my covenant"). But what activity is being described in the first part of the
protasis ("if" condition) of Ex 19:5?




Thanks for any help you can give!!
Dana Densmore
>From kwrandolph AT gmail.com Sun Apr 26 00:03:51 2009
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From: K Randolph <kwrandolph AT gmail.com>
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Yitzhak:

When you lower the argument from an honest disagreement to a personality
spat, I will not go there. I will not answer your last posting.

Karl W. Randolph.




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