Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Yigal Levin <Yigal-Levin AT utc.edu>]

At 05:02 PM 2/11/2003 +0100, Sesamo m. wrote:
>Is it true that the ethymology of the Bible for the name Moses is wrong?
>And is it true that there is a legend about king Sargon of Akkad being saved 
>from a river when a baby? If so, what are the similarities and differences 
>between both stories?
>
>
What does "wrong" mean? Do you mean, that the "real" Moses was named for a
different reason? Was there a "real" Moses? The name "Mose" is a common
element in Egyptian names, meaning "born of", and appears in such royal
names as Ahmose and Thutmose. IF there was an "original" Moses who was
adopted and named by an Egyptian princess, this COULD have been part of his
name, which the Hebrew tradition then tried to explain with a Hebrew
etymology.

And yes, Sargon of Akkad was said to have been put afloat on the Euphrates
by his mother, found by the gardiner of the king of Kish, and eventually
became king of Kish himself, before going on to found Akkad. See Y. Levin,
"Nimrod the Mighty, King of Kish, King of Sumer and Akkad", Vetus
Testementum 52 (2002), 350-366 for more references.

Yigal



Dr. Yigal Levin
Dept. of Philosophy and Religion
University of Tennessee at Chattanooga
615 McCallie Avenue
Chattanooga TN 37403-2598
U.S.A.
>From Polycarp66 AT aol.com  Tue Feb 11 14:17:59 2003
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Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] gods & angels + Moses,  etymology of
To: Izzy_Cohen AT bmc.com, b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
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In a message dated 2/11/2003 1:38:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
Izzy_Cohen AT bmc.com writes:

> "Lisbeth S. Fried" <lizfried AT umich.edu> wrote:
> 
> >... The term "angel" is a translation of mal'ach, 
> >which just means messenger. Angel is from the Greek 
> >angelos which also means messenger. High gods used 
> >lower level gods as messengers, you can see that all 
> >through the Ugaritic tales.
> 
> Compare Hermes
> an ancient Greek god, the herald and messenger of the 
> other gods, associated with commerce, invention, and 
> cunning: identified by the Romans with Mercury.
> 
> and the REVERSAL of kHeRMes
> 
> MeRCury
> 4. (cap.) the Roman god of commerce, thievery, 
>   eloquence, and science, and messenger to the 
>   other gods: identified with the Greek god Hermes.
> 
> Compare MeRCury with Hebrew mem-lamed-aleph-khaf 
>     MaL?aKH = angel.
> 
> >There are lots of gods in the OT, the Hebrews were 
> >commanded not to worship any but YHWH. The gods 
> >divided the nations of the world, ...
> 
> Hermes took Asia minor. He was a Phoenician god 
> living atop Mt. Hermon before he moved to Mt. Olympus.
> His navel (< Sanskrit nabhila) is REVERSED at LeBaNon.
> His name still appears near his heel between Oman
> and Iran/Persia: the Strait of HoRMuz. King HiRaM 
> (who made an agreement with King Soloman) probably
> claimed descent from HeRMes.
> 
> So, we see (superstitious) REVERSAL as an analog
> of non-utterance for names/words one should not
> pronounce.
> 
> >and YHWH took the sons of Jacob as his inheritance.
> >Liz
> 
> Substitute a velar G/K for the yod, DH for the heh,
> F for the vav, and DH for the heh to produce 
> GoTT/KaTH + FaTH[er], that is, the father-G-d
> or creator. If so, Catholic = god-like or godly. 
> Cathedral <"god" + XeDeR = room, not <chair.
> 
> Dan Moonhawk Alford wrote (on the MotherTongue list):
> >... Latin Jupiter [yu-piter] is equivalent to Greek 
> >Zeus-Pater [zus-pater], or "God the Father", whatever 
> >language you wish to pronounce it in.
> 
> "Sesamo m." <sesamox AT hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> >Is it true that the etymology of the Bible for the 
> >name Moses is wrong?
> 
> Treating shin as T and heh as DH, MoSHeH = M-ToTH,
> that is, "from Thoth". Very appropriate, if given 
> by an Egyptian princess (adoptive mother).
> 
> Thoth (thohth, toht)  n. 
> the ancient Egyptian god of learning and magic, 
> represented as a man with the head of an ibis or 
> a baboon and considered as the scribe of the gods.
> 
> But, consider the Egyptian equivalent of 
> mem-tzadi-aleph = to find, hence "foundling". 
> But I doubt the princess would have named him so.
> 

Are you suggesting that [Greek] hERMHS and [Hebrew] MLK derive from the same 
source with a L > R or R > L shift? 

gfsomsel
>From ben.crick AT argonet.co.uk  Tue Feb 11 17:54:07 2003
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On Tue 11 Feb 2003 (08:19:08), lizfried AT umich.edu wrote:
> The so-called "angels" in the OT are also other gods.
> There are only gods, humans and animals.
> Gods differ from humans and animals in having imortal life.
> Humans differ from animals in having knowledge of good and evil.
> [snip]

 Dear Daladier,

 Liz has given you a plain answer. IMHO it is helpful to distinguish between
 the uncreated Creator YHWH on the one hand, and all his living creatures,
 angelic, human and animal, on the other.

 It is for the creatures to worship their Creator, and not to worship other
 creatures however exalted. The creatures are also to serve their Creator,
 and not to rebel against him. For his human creatures, God has provided a
 way of sacrifice to atone for sin and rebellion; e.g. Leviticus 17:11.
 As far as we are aware, there is no such provision for the fallen angels who
 rebelled against Him. The B:NeY-Ha'e:LoHiYM in Ganesis 6:2 were not immortal:
 they and their giant offspring all perished in the Flood.

 IMHO Job 1 and 2 give a glimpse into the Council of YHWH (SoWD YHWH),
 referred to in Jeremiah 23:18 and elsewhere. The true prophets such as
 Jeremiah and Micaiah, etc., had been privy to the Counsel of YHWH, whereas
 the false prophets had not. Compare 1 Kings 22:19-23 // 2 Chronicles 
18:18-22.

 From Job 1:6 and 2:1, it seems as if the SoWD YHWH was some sort of divine
 Standing Committee or Privy Council meeting at prearranged intervals.

 Shalom,
 Ben
-- 
 Revd Ben Crick BA CF, and Mrs Joanna (Goodwin) Crick
 <ben.crick AT argonet.co.uk>
 232 Canterbury Road, Birchington, Kent, CT7 9TD (UK)
 http://www.cnetwork.co.uk/crick.htm