[permaculture] what about lubrication?

lbsaltzman at aol.com lbsaltzman at aol.com
Fri Mar 28 15:36:10 EDT 2008

It will be extremely difficult to accomplish, but it is worth the effort. We have to change our ways. That is why?I got involved in Permaculture in the first place.? I just saw an extremely inspirationally movie called "Amazing Grace". It was the story of William Wilburforce an English parliamentarian and student of John Newton (a former slave caption who wrote the song Amazing Grace). Wilburforce fought for over two decades in Parliament until he succeeded in getting a bill passed that ended the slave trade. He was laughed at for many years before he succeeded.

-----Original Message-----
From: Harmon Seaver <hseaver at gmail.com>
To: permaculture <permaculture at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 11:46 am
Subject: Re: [permaculture] what about lubrication?

   It will also be extremely difficult to accomplish -- the current
scenario was all built in a time of cheap energy. Building new
infrastructure -- railroads, trolley systems, whatever -- in a time of
very expensive energy just probably won't happen. And right now there
certainly isn't the political will to even start building them. Most
people in government are far too clueless, as are the people who elect
them, to do anything meaningful until it will be far, far, too late.
   Try going to your local government body -- city, county -- and tell
them to curtail their current plans for roads and instead invest it all
in lite-rail. Lotsa' luck! They'll laugh you right out of the room.

lbsaltzman at aol.com wrote:
> I?have been following this conversation with interest. I am not an expert on 
biofuels, but the missing question with all of this, is what quantity of 
biofuels and biolubricants can be sustainably harvested without damaging 
ecosystems, and impacting the production of food for the world's population. I 
suspect not enough to permit the burning of biofuels at the rate we currently 
burn fossil fuels. That implies that we are going to have a lot less energy to 
run vehicles, and a lot less vehicles.? So that also suggests that we should be 
putting a lot of thinking into alternative ways of doing things that don't 
involve the mass use of vehicles for transportation and as labor saving devices. 
It will be the hugest reallocation of resources since the industrial revolution. 
It will be in fact the reversal of how the industrial revolution has allocated 

Harmon Seaver
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