[permaculture] Re: Thilo's web page in comparison to ATTRA's web page

Steve Diver steved at ncatark.uark.edu
Mon Mar 25 19:55:19 EST 2002

Resending this..  the first one jumped off my keyboard before it
was finished....

Thilo -

With all due respect, amigo, how do you explain the document

Permaculture FAQ
And Alternative Farming Systems

Thilo Pfennig

v.2.0, 29 Dec 2001
formerly "Introduction to Permaculture: Concepts and Resource"
prepared by Steve Diver ATTRA Technical Specialist (1998)

11. About this Publication

Permaculture FAQ 2.0 is a revised and updated version of "Introduction to
Permaculture: Concepts and Resources" , which was originally published
by Steve Diver.

Copyright (c) 2000 by Thilo Pfennig
Please freely copy and distribute (sell or give away) this document in
any format. It's requested that corrections and/or comments be fowarded
to the document maintainer. You may create a derivative work and
distribute it provided that you:

1.Send your derivative work (in the most suitable format such as sgml) to
the on the Internet.
2.License the derivative work with this same license or use GPL. Include
a copyright notice and at least a pointer to the license used.
3.Give due credit to previous authors and major contributors.

If you're considering making a derived work other than a translation, it's
requested that you discuss your plans with the current maintainer.

Steve Diver, that is myself, is the author of that piece and ATTRA is
the publisher.  ATTRA is very liberal with its permission -- on
request -- to use parts of ATTRA publication in print articles,
copying for workshops, etc.  But I don't think ATTRA likes
people to take whole publications and have people put their
name on it, label it as copyrighted, and offer it for everybody
else to take and rip off.  No wonder paragraphs from this
publication show up all over the web with no credit to the
original author.

The SGML version you put together is certainly a value-added
way to present this information, but I think you have overstepped
your boundary by ascribing yourself as author, re-naming the title,
and claiming copyright for something that was written and published
by others.

Fyi, ATTRA puts a *lot* of effort into crafting these pieces
on sustainable farming, organic farming, permaculture, biodynamics,
etc.  In addition, enormous effort goes into proper credit for
publications and articles, and sometimes, to obtain permission for
pieces of published items such as a table, illustrations, etc.
As you can expect, our reputation is valueable and we
have high internal standards for publishing.  For example, the
excerpt from Michael Pilarski's book was kindly asked from
Pilarski in a phone conversation.   ATTRA is a non-profit
organization, by the way, so you are not dealing with government
nincomp-poops but people that work and live in the trenches.

There are ways to use material appropriately, with credit, etc.

There are ways to build collaborations and to put value on a product,
such as you have done with SGML.

Would you like to offer an explanation of your broad-minded
approach to the ATTRA publication that you have "authored",
re-named, and laid a copyright claim to?

Steve Diver

Thilo Pfennig wrote:

> Am Mon, 2002-03-25 um 07.40 schrieb David Holmgren & Su Dennett:
> > These articles can be downloaded as screen readable pdfs from
> > http://www.spacountry.net.au/holmgren/CollWrit.html  but cannot be
> > printed nor can text be selected for pasting into other documents .
> Tey can be printed. I just did. With Linux using 'gv' instead of the
> Acrobat Reader.
> You should not trust into proprietary technology.
> > (These blocks protect the integrity of writings posted on web sites).
> Allthough I do understand your intentions I do not believe that those
> kind of blockings are the right way.
> I also could produce a Poscript file out of it:
> http://www.alternativ.net/landwirtschaft/permakultur/holmgren/01.ps
> > The CD is PC and Mac compatible and costs A$25.00 plus postage from
> > Holmgren Design Services
> Also think about if CDs are also Linux compatible. (They are not if
> everything is packed into binary programs and there is no Linux binary).
> I always thought in permaculture people would have a broader view.
> --
> Thilo Pfennig
> http://www.alternativ.net/edv/
> _______________________________________________
> permaculture mailing list
> permaculture at lists.ibiblio.org
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/permaculture

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