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msar-riders - Re: [MSAR] Subject: What you really do

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Subject: Mounted search and rescue

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  • From: "IRVIN LICHTENSTEIN" <ilichten1@verizon.net>
  • To: "'Mounted search and rescue'" <msar-riders@lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [MSAR] Subject: What you really do
  • Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2008 00:35:05 -0500

I approve purchases for both the MSAR and a local fire company where I am a
trustee. I buy on specification, form, fit, and function (FFF). If I buy
from a "fire" only supplier or the product is characterized as a "rescue"
product the price is from 150% higher or more. We bought a Zodiac boat in
grey instead of orange and saved thousands of dollars-- same boat, same
specification except for color and the word "RESCUE" stenciled on the sides,
and the warranty was longer because there was no warranty on rescue boats.

I bought custom reflective lettering for my trailer, 4 sets of the word
HORSES, for about $3 a letter, 12 inches square, white Scotchlite,
pre-spaced on an adhesive backer from a police decal catalog. A mounted
police site offered similar signs, much smaller, non-reflective, for about
twice the cost. The saddlery I deal with had my saddle custom made with a
Percheron sized tree (they measured the horse on site), flank strap, extra
large skirt and fender leathers, rough out finish and all fittings, for
about $1000 and the only part I have replaced so far (close to 20 years) is
the string girth. What does an off the shelf leather patrol saddle cost?
The saddlebags are Cordura, also custom sized, but at the wholesale cost for
a stock bag. I happen to have big feet and fat legs so I indulge in custom
boots, same saddlery, in the winter off season Dehner has a discount sale
and I get my boots made, one pair about every 8 years, for about what the
street shoes I wear out in the same time cost, and cheaper than most off the
shelf riding boots. Dehner is a supplier to the California Highway Patrol
by the way.

We don't have a choice about buying radios because the county system is a
800 MHz trunk and they are proprietary but I can buy batteries for the
radios at half the cost from an independent supplier with identical specs to
the radio manufacturer, and probably made by the same Chinese labor as makes
the other. For MSAR VHF I bought military specification B-K used units from
a used equipment dealer for from $100 down to $55 each. These units had new
dealer cost of $1047 each. I also bought two new Chinese batteries for each
radio for about what a dealer pays for a single battery from B-K. According
to the paperwork with them the radios came from the Columbia University
Campus Police.

And lastly, manufacturers self certify that their equipment meets NFPA
standards or whatever. There is no requirement for outside testing except
for SEI testing of ASTM helmets. In many cases the FFF and operational
specification are the same, tested or not. If you want a testing
certificate you pay for it with much higher prices and then also have usage
restrictions (warranty and certification void if not stored and used in
accordance with the standard).

We are spending other people's money when we buy or suggest sources for MSAR
equipment. We must do so responsibly. The only item our team specifies is
the patch we wear, available only from us for members at $2 each. They cost
us $1.85 plus shipping.

Irv Lichtenstein

-----Original Message-----
From: msar-riders-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:msar-riders-bounces@lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Pennbo's
Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2008 11:18 PM
To: Mounted search and rescue
Subject: Re: [MSAR] Subject: What you really do

> Stay away from sources that claim to MSAR specialists or search
> specialists.
Irv- could you explain your reasoning on this a bit more? It's rather a
broad generalization.

Thanks,
Chris
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