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  • From: Chris Andrew <cjhandrew AT gmail.com>
  • To: David Kowis <dkowis AT shlrm.org>, "sm-discuss AT lists.ibiblio.org" <sm-discuss AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: Re: [SM-Discuss] Project Lead Speech
  • Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2011 07:24:00 +0000

Wow David, just read your email. It is the most relevant thing I have ever seen on this list!

As a user, I agree with all of your points and it sounds like your ideas could make a great distribution even better. I'd be especially keen to see a 'clearer/ cleaner' web presence, which may help casual users to try SMGL. I'd be keen to see a proper download page with torrents that I could seed.

I could write much more, but fudamentally, you have good proposals and I would welcome this sort of plan.

Thanks,

Chris (chris_debian)

On 5 Mar 2011 23:18, "David Kowis" <dkowis AT shlrm.org> wrote:
> tl;dr: I HAS IDEARS AND WANT TO CHANGE SOME THINGS. VOET FOR ME! KTHX
> -- But seriously, read it.
>
> <Personalized Subject Time Here> Mage,
>
> SourceMage is my favorite distro. Unfortunately, it is also the distro
> that causes much rage for me. I have been unable to use SMGL as my
> desktop for quite a while now. I'd boot up my linux, want to do some
> work, "Oh, need to update <spell> to do whatever." Do the update. 1-2
> hours later, my system is either broken, or Firefox no longer works. Or
> maybe X has crapt it's pants.
>
> For servers, there is no equal to Source Mage for customization. Updates
> are far less disastrous in that arena. I run SMGL as my Xen domain0, and
> will continue to do so for the foreseeable future. I have picked out
> some Fedora VMs to run some things. I should probably use CentOS or
> something that doesn't update often, once they get the items I want in
> the distro. Not because I dislike SourceMage, but because I kept running
> into problems using things. Castfs would occasionally barf on me and eat
> up 100% of the CPU time. Often an update to glibc, or gcc would
> irrevocably break my system. Updating server software, like Apache,
> Proftpd, Postfix, Postgresql, or MySQL (Yeah, I should switch to mariadb
> [fsck oracle]) all work wonderfully. Rarely have I run into an issue
> when updating those spells.
>
> Now that I've laid out my gripes and praises for SMGL you might be
> wondering why I even accepted the Project Lead nomination if I've got so
> many things that I don't like about SMGL and when I use it less. I
> /want/ to use SMGL. I miss it. But I can "just use" Fedora easier. I
> want to rectify this situation. I want to be able to "just use" SMGL
> more. I want to improve the spell writing process so that it's easier to
> handle simple version bumps. I want to collect more feedback from the
> users automatically, detailing what architecture they're running, and
> what spells they're installing, and whether they succeeded or failed.
> This will give us, the crafters of the distro, better insight into
> what's going on. Simplifying the spell writing process, I believe, will
> help us spend less time on version updates. Ultimate goal would be
> something like having a bot that listens to the sm-spell-updates list
> and can automatically update a spell's version, run a test cast, and
> commit the spell into a branch or a patch, so that it's subject to
> developer approval. We'd have a software system where the test cast
> would include installed files, and whatever other data we wanted
> collected for us automatically, so that we don't have to do all that
> work manually, and our precious developer time can be better spent on
> real issues.
>
> Secondly, and possibly more importantly, I want to lower the barrier to
> entry for developing on Sorcery. The last announcement for a stable
> sorcery release was almost two years ago. I couldn't find an
> announcement for 1.14.4. I'd like to develop a roadmap of features that
> we want to have. I want to have them defined using some kind of testing
> framework, so we know when these features are accomplished, and so we
> can easily verify that we've not made any regressions. Bringing down the
> barrier to entry for development on our core system is important. We
> need to allow developers to provide enhancements and bug fixes whilst
> still ensuring that nothing is being broken, and we need to be able to
> do it without all the verification resting on one person.
>
> Thirdly, I want to clean up our bug tracker and our presence on the
> World Wide Web(tm). If this involves a cutover to a completely different
> bug tracker, or just setting up a second bugzilla and exporting the open
> bugs we actually care about. I would like to have better integration
> with the bug tracker, the source repository, the wiki, and static web
> pages. Something like Redmine or Trac might be nice. We could probably
> achieve the same thing with individual pieces of software, but given how
> much we use the website, I think it'd be quicker and easier just to go
> for an integrated solution and then solve individual issues if/when we
> come to them. At the least, I want to pick out a different wiki (I know,
> *again*) that has a suitable spam solution, or integrates better with
> some kind of centralized account management.
>
> I want to get back into the habit of holding developer meetings again.
> We'll post our agenda on the wiki, and everyone can edit the agenda so
> anyone can bring up anything, as long as it's planned out on the agenda.
> This will help us keep our meeting short, sweet, and people will know
> what is going to go on and whether or not they need to be there.
> Obviously, I'll try to be at most all the meetings, or have an Assistant
> Project Lead designated to act in my stead. I think meetings once a
> quarter would be a good goal to start with.
>
> I'd like to have some kind of incentive system set up for people that
> volunteer to do the nasty work that no one wants to do, or isn't any
> fun. I'm uncertain how this would come into being. Recommendations from
> an Open Source community might carry weight in some professional
> circles. Or perhaps Developer of the Week status on the website. I'm
> uncertain how this would evolve out, but I want to help motivate people
> to do some of the things that are hard, like say, replacing
> simpleinit-msb, or unifying the gcc spells again along with rebuilds and
> such. The real tough projects that are more than "I bumped the version
> and added a configure flag." A bit of publicity you can add to your
> LinkedIn account, Facebook, or <Social networking Thinger Here>.
>
> I think that's probably a pretty ambitious set of goals:
> * Configuration Feedback System
> * Improved Spell Config
> * Automated Testing
> * Lower Barrier for Sorcery Development
> * Improved Web Presence
> * Developer Meetings
> * Incentive System
>
> Obviously, I can't do all these myself, I will need your willingness and
> cooperation to do things you may not find fun, and maybe even some
> things you don't necessarily agree with. I'm easy on deadlines, but I
> want well defined goals. We can always push something off until later.
> As for well defined goals: I don't like things like "it works on my
> machine." I want some kind of test that can be run by everyone, manually
> as a last resort. I want to build confidence in our distro, and I'll
> need your help to do it.
>
> Of course, if you think Source Mage is the best thing ever (it *is*),
> but you don't want *anything* to change, a vote in my favor might not be
> the best option. I want to keep the core of Source Mage the same:
>
> Systems Admin choice rules supreme.
>
> I want to make it easier for us to give the SysAdmins the best spells
> with the most options, and the safest upgrade path possible. No small task.
>
> David
>



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