Hi Ryan,
Wanted to check on the way we could discuss how we can practically adapt donation appeals to the different regions at the summit. We wrote earlier in this thread about the need for a discussion on this, with the summit as a logical time.
Is there already a session proposal in the works, shall we collaborate on one and/or shall I create a first draft/idea on how I was thinking about it?
Cheers,
Lisette
[cross-posting to cc-affiliates]
Thanks Maarten for your comments. A few replies and next steps:
- We'll use Transifex to set up strings we want to translate - I
want to work in existing workflows we know, not design new ones
unless necessary.
- The request will be for affiliates to translate w/in 1 or 2
weeks. If there is a desire for alternate language to adapt to
cultural differences, we should work through it together. That helps
us understand those differences.
- I'll keep the fundraising discussion on the existing mailing
lists, but I'll default to cc-affiliates for the same reason you
raised about compartmentalization. I think all would benefit from
the discussion that happened on cc-europe.
- I will report out on how fundraising is going with data/stats in
September.
- I will set up a monthly fundraising hangout for those who want
more engagement in the planning.
Best,
Ryan
On 2015-06-23 9:05 AM, Maarten Zeinstra
wrote:
Hi Ryan,
Thanks for the reply. I’ve waited to respond to this
because I was seeing if others on this list wanted to reply
too.Also because I probably got it off hours, thought I
responded but didn’t :)
I’ve put comments inline.
Best,
Maarten
--
Kennisland | www.kl.nl | t
+31205756720 | m +31643053919 | @mzeinstra
Hi
Maarten,
Sorry for the slow reply -- I've been in San Francisco
this week meeting with funders and platform partners.
Your comments are very helpful. Perhaps it's best if I
share a proposed approach, and let's find a model that
works. Ideally, we would translate and publish all page
content at once. I will admit that I had some
assumptions about how the site works that are now
clearly not the case. For example, there is no staging
server, so we can't see things before they're live. If
we want to translate these strings offline, we'll need
to set something up separately.
re: translation -- my approach to translation is more
"localization" or "adaptation" -- we don't have to
literally say exactly the same thing. In fundraising, I
think that's important. So long as the appeal carries
the sentiment and the specific request to give, I think
there should be latitude for translators to adapt to
culture/tone.
Further, I'm happy to have discussion about the core
content/ask, and appreciate the comments we already
received, which we're going to incorporate into the site
and test. However, to get statistically valid test data,
we'll have to run the language for several months, less
if donation rates pick up significantly (which is
possible).
Here's my proposal, feedback welcome:
- I will share a document with the updated strings for
translation (including the "donate now" button).
You could do that already in Transifex I believe, In
transifex you can put the strings you want available. You
then call the strings when you need them. I believe CC now
lets Transifex reactively scan each page request for
translation, which are then added if they are not previously
available. However, you could also actively push strings in
there. That is far less overhead than a separate document
and its maintenance.
- Affiliates will translate (within a week or two), but
if there is a local proposal to functionally change the
content to adapt to a local need, we discuss and agree
together (this is important to me, because we need to
understand how they are changed if they do well, or do
poorly, and also because I want to understand the
differences)
- CC publishes the pages, tracks data, and shares
results at the end of September (Q3) before we go into
our year-end campaign planning
Good idea.
- We set up a separate mailing list and monthly office
hours for all those interested in working on donor
strategy -- we have a lot of work to do here in the next
number of months, and I also want the discussion to not
be limited to cc-Europe -- nor do I want to fill
cc-affiliates with all that donor content.
I would rather have a public discussion.
Compartmentalising only leads to exclusion of community
members that were not aware of a discussion from the start.
Also as I believe most of us have no really a large interest
in the fundraising in itself, only when it touches the work
they are doing as affiliates.
I really appreciate all the feedback, criticism, and
ideas. CC is not good at this yet, but we have to become
good at it. It's a struggle with full-time people, a
fundraising agency on retainer, and volunteers who have
deep investment in these pages. But I'm confident we'll
work it out, and I'm committed to doing it.
I think this will remain an ongoing struggle as with all
of these projects like Wikimedia. It’s the game we are in :)
Best,
Ryan
On 2015-06-14 4:49 PM,
Maarten Zeinstra wrote:
Hi Ryan,
Thanks for the nuanced response. I
believe the friction that we are experiencing is not
about the necessity of attracting funds for CC
Global but a lack of involvement or perceived
restrictions of involvement from the European side.
For me this was triggered by needing to
translate a sentence that was so undutch in its way
of addressing the Dutch public. Now you said in a
mail that you are open for all feedback, you’ve got
some for use about the wording of the donation
notice on the deed pages. I’ve not seen a response
to that or a structured way to discuss that donation
message.
Also, and this is a pet peeve, but the
response to our initial concern was met with a mail
by you stating you want to restrict this to the
English language for now. Should you then make these
messages available on other language deed pages?
Also if you want to enable translations please make
them available in such a way that we can at least
have our languages in the system before the change
goes live. Also make sure that all sentences are
translatable. While Dutch is completely translated
according to Transifex, the dutch deed pages have a
English ‘donate now’ button: https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/deed.nl The
Dutch and Belgian team has spent many person months
translating the licenses and deeds and we pride
ourselves of having a Dutch translation. To us this
looks unprofessional.
And this touches also a bit on the
underlying feeling I/we have here. The affiliates
feel ownership over these product because of the
hard work we put into them. However we also feel a
loss of control over them, this frustrates.
Best,
Maarten
--
Kennisland | www.kl.nl |
t +31205756720 | m +31643053919 | @mzeinstra
Hi all,
Thanks for the discussion and comments --
I'm sorry to not have engaged sooner. I
wasn't on the CC-Europe list and so didn't
see it until John W brought it to my
attention. I am here now.
CC needs to seek donations from everywhere
in the world. By comparison, Mozilla
receives over 40 percent of its small dollar
donor revenues from outside of the US, in
all the regions where CC also operates.
About two thirds of Wikipedia's funding came
from outside North America in 2013/14.
Donation cultures are different everywhere,
but there are also people everywhere who are
willing to give to support CC (and many
already do). We have to figure out how to
reach them and speak to them in a way that
will be most likely to inspire them to give.
I can't (and don't intend to) figure out how
to do that without all of you.
We're working to develop the right messages
and tactics for creativecommons.org, and my
intention is to pilot those attempts in EN
first, and then work with all of you to
localize. Based on the Mozilla and Wikipedia
experience, the three biggest factors that
drive international donation rates up are
localization, payment methods, and
currencies accepted. The last two are much
harder to implement than the first. On
localization, we can work together to design
and test (and re-test), and I hope that we
will. If you're interested in working with
me on that now, please send me an e-mail.
Otherwise, there will be a more general call
as we refine the EN strategy and prepare to
consider other markets.
I'm committed, and happy to commit as you
ask below, to working with affiliates and to
consider the recommendations. As I mentioned
in my previous e-mail, we will ensure all of
you are aware of what we're planning in
advance, and engage you in the discussion on
how to do it.
CC has no choice but to become good at
fundraising. It's my first priority, because
it gives us what we need to support you,
maintain the licenses, and execute our
projects. This year, CC's direct investment
and support in the community will be over a
half a million dollars (travel,
co-ordinators, Summit), and our budget is
$3.2M. Last year's fundraising program was
our most successful ever, raising $200k USD.
So even with strong growth, we still have a
ways to go.
I like Lisette's suggestion, and I'll gladly
lead and/or participate in a discussion at
the summit about fundraising and
collaboration and design of programs along
with affiliates.
Best,
Ryan
PS - One small point that I think is
important. CC HQ's activities and policies
are not being developed for the US market
only. I'm also not American. I still accep
the points about CC HQ having its own
strategy, and that there are local
affiliates with their own programs
(including CC US), but I would ask that we
attempt to be precise about CC HQ rather
than calling it the US org.
On 2015-06-10
4:12 PM, Alek Tarkowski wrote:
Dear all,
Maarten, I agree with what
you write, especially the part about
ownership. I think the whole issue is
about us having a sense of not having a
say in an issue that we have some stake
in, build over the years.
John, it would be great if
next time we could have an inclusive
process and a consultation on
funding-related matters. This has been
mentioned for years. I still think it's
a pity this current issue will be left
as is. I like LIsette's idea about a
workshop at the Summit - but this will
only work if the HQ makes some
commitment to be in this process and
consider / adopt the results.
But there is a broader issue
of governance behind all this. I think
it's up to us as affiliates to come up
with some proposals of issues about
which we believe that we should have a
say, and a proposal for a method to
conduct this.
Best,
Alek
On Jun 10, 2015, at 15:36,
Lisette Kalshoven < lk AT kl.nl>
wrote:
Hi John,
That is good news,
looking forward to the digest of
the call.
Perhaps we can
organise a session during the
Summit where we can discuss the
diversification of the messages
per region? CC NL would be happy
to contribute.
Cheers,
Lisette
--
Kennisland | www.kennisland.nl |
t +31205756720 |
m +31613943237 | @lnkalshoven
| skype: lisette.kalshoven
Hi
Maarten et al,
as a result of
the pop-up issue and the
discussion here on the
list, we discussed in
yesterday's staff-call the
inclusion of the affiliate
network in future
donation-related tests and
tinkering. I'll send the
digest of the call in a
separate email. The
message was well received
by all incl. the rather
new staff members, so I
think we're making
progress here for
everybody's benefit.
I also
mentioned the next State
of the Commons Report as a
central focus point to get
staff and affiliates
working together on
overall funding. There
might even be potential in
diversifying the donation
messages for different
parts of the world, for
which the regional/local
Affiliates could also
offer their unique
expertise.
Best
John
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koordynator,
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European Policy
Fellow, Creative Commons
Twitter: @atarkowski /
@ccpolska
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Ryan Merkley
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+1 416.802.0662
@ryanmerkley
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ryan AT creativecommons.org
+1 416.802.0662
@ryanmerkley
Get Creative Commons Updates http://bit.ly/commonsnews
--
Ryan Merkley
CEO, Creative Commons
ryan AT creativecommons.org
+1 416.802.0662
@ryanmerkley
Get Creative Commons Updates http://bit.ly/commonsnews
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