Developer discussion for Creative Commons technology and tools

[Jon Phillips <jon AT rejon.org>]

I totally agree...need this integrated into the workflow...Adobe will
hopefully be into this now with their share service
(http://share.adobe.com) and getting their bizness knicked by so many
other web apps...also, adobe is working on making web apps versions of
their desktop apps! 

Jon


On Fri, 2007-10-05 at 08:57 -0700, Mike Linksvayer wrote:
> Interesting XMP comments at URLs below, also one on the CC Adobe custom
> panel that I agree with
> http://www.crossref.org/CrossTech/2007/09/custom_panel_for_cc.html --
>         
>         But I still think that batch solutions for adding XMP metadata
>         are really required for publishing workflows.
> 
> We do have a Java/iText batch solution that someone should point out to
> him. :)
> 
> -------- Forwarded Message --------
> From: Tony Hammond <tony.hammond AT gmail.com>
> To: Bijan Parsia <bparsia AT cs.man.ac.uk>
> Cc: SW-forum Web <semantic-web AT w3.org>
> Subject: XMP [Re: RDF: XULing or Grueling]
> Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2007 16:34:44 +0100
> 
> Hi Bijan:
> 
> > (I suppose XMP is still chugging, yes? Does creative commons still
> > use RDF? Is anyone tracking these attempts over time and writing them
> > up as case studies?)
> 
> Just to say that XMP is something we are still looking at in the STM
> community. See these recent couple posts on CrossTech:
> 
> The Second Wave
> http://www.crossref.org/CrossTech/2007/09/the_second_wave.html
> 
> "XMP has much in common with RSS 1.0. They are both profiles of
> RDF/XML. They are both flawed in certain respects because of
> self-imposed limitations. But they both build on a robust and open
> data model for the web (RDF) and are reasonably open, at least they
> are extensible."
> 
> XMP-Ville
> http://www.crossref.org/CrossTech/2007/09/xmpville.html
> 
> "Been so busy looking into the technical details of XMP that I almost
> forgot to check out the current landcsape. Luckily I chanced on these
> articles by Ron Roszkiewicz for The Seybold Report (and apologies for
> lifting the title of this post from his last)."
> 
> Further posts on XMP as I've gotten to grips with it are also posted here
> 
> http://www.crossref.org/mt/mt-search.cgi?IncludeBlogs=4&search=xmp
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Tony
> 
> 
> 
> On 10/4/07, Bijan Parsia <bparsia AT cs.man.ac.uk> wrote:
> >
> > http://www.jerf.org/resources/xblinjs/whyNotMozilla/notXulTemplates.html
> > http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/whatwg/20071004#%23l-543
> >
> > These days, I generally muck in the OWL end of things, as y'all might
> > have noticed. However, I see these sorts of RDF bashing now and again
> > and wonder. Several of the showcase applications of RDF from earlier
> > in the 00s seem to have gone a bit bust leaving a bad taste in some
> > folks mouth (RSS 1.0, XUL, I would say OWL's RDF syntax..certainly
> > for me; I didn't *start out* disliking it in the DAML+OIL days; my
> > own personal cross the WSDL RDF mapping).
> >
> > Now some of these may have had other factors as well (RSS 1.0 is an
> > obvious example). But it's not clear to me that RSS 1.0 is such a
> > great idea. If we could press a button and eliminate all the other
> > flavors and Atom, or RDFize all of them, would we do so? Would it be
> > a good idea?
> >
> > (I suppose XMP is still chugging, yes? Does creative commons still
> > use RDF? Is anyone tracking these attempts over time and writing them
> > up as case studies?)
> >
> > In my experience, several communities resented the injection of RDF
> > "from above" (certainly that was a strong feeling in the WSDL group).
> > Exposure made them more angry about it rather than less. This is not
> > a happy thing. When I compare with things like JSON (which is
> > popular) or YAML (which I think isn't nearly as popular...don't have
> > anything more than my impression), they don't seem to arose the same
> > sort of hostility, nor are they generally *imposed*. (Though
> > interesting, in that same chat log there is a bit of discussion about
> > why Hixie defined his own syntax for a manifest file instead of using
> > JSON or even XML.)
> >
> > The linked data stuff seems harmless in that afaict it doesn't hork
> > anyone off and seems sorta neat (though I've personally not read a
> > lot of excitement about it from outside our community; pointers are
> > welcome).
> >
> > Sorry to ramble: My question is whether we can or should come up with
> > an analysis of these cases. Both the tactics of pushing adoption and
> > the actual technological solutions. These don't feel like Clay
> > Shirkleyesque confused naysaying, but some real issues. Maybe the
> > issues are *all* idiosyncratic (e.g., perhaps mozilla's "bad" RDF
> > implementation was to blame for the perceived problems...but then,
> > why didn't any of us step up to the plate and fix it? did we not
> > think this was an important evangelization opportunity?)
> >
> > GRDDL seems like a reasonable attempt to rehabilitate the hegemonic
> > reputation of the RDF community. So that's potentially good. I'd be
> > interested in some reflection about these cases (and others).
> >
> > BTW, this isn't meant as a nay-saying bit, but as a wanting to derive
> > useful lessons from past experience. The above links *do* contain nay-
> > saying, but I'm less interested in refuting that than understanding
> > what drove it and if there is any way to do better.
> >
> > (Does SWEO do case studies where RDF "failed"? Or analyses of when
> > RDF might not be the right choice?)
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Bijan.
> >
> >
> 
-- 
Jon Phillips

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