Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Dave Washburn <davidlwashburn AT gmail.com>]

I agree with everything you said. However, when it comes to Hebrew, I'm not
convinced that we know as much as we need to about the "basic" syntax of the
language to be able to sift out what are "violations" in poetry. Scholars
can't even agree on such basics as basal component order: VSO or SVO? There
are good arguments for both. (I'm in the latter category, if it matters.)
This is why I have chosen to restrict my own syntactic investigations to
prose. It's a conscious choice and I know that I end up neglecting large
parts of the Hebrew Bible, but based on my view of the nature of language,
it's a methodological necessity. Others' mileage may vary, and I have no
problem with that. Hopefully we're all working toward the same goal, and
that's a Very Good Thing (TM).

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 9:32 AM, Bryant J. Williams III <bjwvmw AT com-pair.net
> wrote:

> Dear Dave,
>
> In one sense I would agree with you, but in another sense I would disagree.
> That
> sense that I disagree with is that much of what can be learned from poetry
> would
> help in defining the narrative use much better. Is it not true that poetry
> is
> more free-wheeling in its use of grammar and syntax? At least, that is what
> appears to be the case. My only problem with this is that most scholars do
> not
> understand poetry enough to understand that poetry has its own rules or
> conventions that must be adhered to. In modern poetry, at least since free
> verse
> became to be considered poetry, ca. 19th Century CE, this has become more
> of a
> problem. So, I would say that reasons for neglect of Hebrew poetry is more
> due
> to the lack of knowledge of the genre than any thing else.
>
> Rev. Bryant J. Williams III
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave Washburn" <davidlwashburn AT gmail.com>
> To: <b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 9:15 AM
> Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Hebrew Poetry
>
>
> > To answer Bryant's question, the main reason I don't include poetry when
> I'm
> > studying grammar and syntax is because, in every language I've ever
> looked
> > at, poetry essentially makes its own rules and doesn't really "obey"
> general
> > rules of the language's grammar. It's just my own view, but poetry is not
> > the place to understand a language's syntax.
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:32 PM, K Randolph <kwrandolph AT gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Dera Bryant:
> > >
> > > I wonder how applicable is the development of Tiberian chant to a study
> of
> > > Biblical Hebrew poetry? Is it possible, after centuries of linguistic
> > > change, that the two are only distantly related? The difficulty here is
> > > that
> > > the earliest datable example of poetry (Exodus 15) is over two
> millennia
> > > removed from the earliest example of Tiberian chant. And if we take
> Genesis
> > > 1 as poetry, it is still another millennium and a half older.
> > >
> > > But it is true that so much of Tanakh is poetry.
> > >
> > > Karl W. Randolph.
> > >
> > > It is 16 pages. It begins with an Introduction (page 1), then he gives
> with
> > > > a little music lesson dealing with Singing, Chant, Intonation in
> ordinary
> > > > speech (pp. 2-6). On page 6 Dresher begins the introduction material
> on
> > > > Hebrew Chant with "Recitation formulas: psalm tones;" and continues
> until
> > > > the end with the fundamentals between Gregorian and Hebrew Chant
> styles
> > > both
> > > > in similarities and differences.
> > > >
> > > > Now, my statement and then the list can go at it.
> > > >
> > > > It seems to me that in discussion of grammar and syntax of BH, we
> have
> > > > written about the narrative, but not the poetical side of BH. I find
> that
> > > > this is an interesting omission since roughly half of the Tanakh is
> > > poetry.
> > > > Look at the Writings and the Latter Prophets which are continuously
> using
> > > > poetic devises in order get the message out. I would like to see if
> any
> > > of
> > > > us on the list would be able to say in Dresher is correct on what he
> is
> > > > saying in his article about the similarities and differences between
> > > > Gregorian and Hebrew Chant. I would also go a little further and say
> that
> > > > the Protestant Reformation especially the English Reformation
> contributed
> > > > greatly to the metrical reading, singing and chanting of the Psalms;
> also
> > > > some other passages.
> > > >
> > > > If possible, give a link to any sources otherwise note the complete
> > > source
> > > > information.
> > > >
> > > > Rev. Bryant J. Williams III
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-hebrew
> > > >
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> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Dave Washburn
> >
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-- 
Dave Washburn

Check out my Internet show: http://www.irvingsplace.us

Now available: a novel about King
Josiah!<http://www.smashwords.com/books/view/89444>