Biblical Hebrew Forum

["Bryant J. Williams III" <bjwvmw AT com-pair.net>]

Dear Rob,

Thank you for the updated scientific studies and reports about the flora and
fauna of the Southern Levant with Israel in particular.

[Rob]
Two closing points. By examination of the pollen core samples of soil dating
back to 3000 BC and earlier archaeobotanist have determined the hill country
just north of Jerusalem underwent rapid deforestation beginning about 1400 BC
thruabout 1100BC.

At the same time you will read in the Ungulates piece, a great Extinction of 
the
larger ungulates, the hippos and aurochs began about 1300 BC through about
800BC.

Both incidents indicate the infiltration of a large, non indigenous group into
Canaan which coincides with the invasion of the Hebrews of Joshua's time.   
This
is physical, scientific evidence of an invading group, restricted to a 
specific
time period that is not acknowledged by some (some claim the Hebrews were
indigenous peoples who just took over Canaan over time. The record of
deforestation tells a different story). Unfortunately many mainstream
"authorities" fail to examine the conclusions in archaeobotany, palynology and
zooarchaeology.

[Bryant]
Would have the link to the studies for the information you presented in the
previous paragraphs?


Rev. Bryant J. Williams III

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "rob acosta" <robacosta AT hotmail.com>
To: <b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sunday, May 22, 2011 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Mighty


>
> Jim
>
> My comments were in response to you numerous statements about the supposedly
poor conditions of the SouthernLevant as compared to the north and your use of
this supposed contrast to support your theories as to why Abraham livedin the
northern half of Canaan.If you had left your arguments as simply a matter of
linguistics, that would be one thing.But your assertions about the 
conditionsof
the south versus the north, as though you were an Archaeobotanist on the level
of the great Ofer Bar Yosef  is what prompted my response. Such demonstrably
false assertions cannot be left to stand uncontested.
>
> You wrote:  "It is unlikely that the city of Hebron, by contrast, ever had a
grove of oak trees."
>   The question is, on what is such a statement, and many more like it, 
> based?
Not on science, that is for certain.   Let's set the story straight once and 
for
all. Anyone of the readers of this site can verify these facts for themselves
and don'thave to endure the misinformation of Mr Stinehart..   I suggest you
read: "  Distribution and Extinction of Ungulates during the Holocene of the
Southern Levant"  byElla Tsahar  Ido Izhaki , Simcha Lev-Yadun, , Guy Bar-Oz
>   Available online.Play close attention to the charts: To sum very briefly
>    Locations of ungulates, hoofed animals, from the Bronze age are studied.
>    You will see, Hippopotamus thrived in the Southern Levant during the time
of Abraham as far inland as near Tel Masos and south of Gaza as well as up the
Palestine coast to Haifa.  Hippos, require deep, slow moving rivers and 
abundant
plant life to thrive...both were provided by an obviously lushforest fed by 
the
waters of the hill country, forests which you have denied existed.  Next, look
at the charts for locations of hartebeest  and the incredible, wondrous
Aurochs,(wild cattle) which at the time stoodbetween 6 and 7 feet tall at the
shoulders. They were swift and aggressive making it little wonder they were
consideredto be gods by the locals.  The greatest concentration of all these
animals was in the Southern Levant. Add to this mix lions, bears, panthers,
hyenas, wart hogsetc. This incredible assemblage of wildlife required a lush
ecosystem to support them, and archaeobotanists have determined thepredominant
tree in this forest was the oak.(five varieties)  Oaks live
>   to at least 850 years..   is also a no brainer that with oak as the
predominate tree of the Mediterranean Forest there would be great oaks north 
and
south in Canaan.  We can therefore dismiss  your claims about no oaks in 
Hebron
and in fact every other claim you have made regarding thetrees in Canaan and
Edom.  This is not amateur guessing based on long outdated views, as you do so
frequently, but the conclusions of University Level studies.   During the 
Bronze
Age the southern Levant was what scientists call an "African Echo"...as rich 
and
as lush as any nationalpark in sub saharan Africa.   You claim Hebron was
"modest" and that Abraham used up his wealth here.   Only if he were an
incompetent fool.   The point again being Abraham did not make his decision on
where to go based the Aijulon supposedly being a morefertile, desirable place
than the south. That is an outdated, uninformed view.
>    Two closing points. By examination of the pollen core samples of soil
dating back to 3000 BC and earlier archaeobotanisthave determined the hill
country just north of Jerusalem underwent rapid deforestation beginning about
1400 BC thruabout 1100BC.
>   At the same time you will read in the Ungulates piece, a great Extinction 
> of
the larger ungulates, the hippos and aurochsbegan about 1300 BC through about
800BC.
>   Both incidents indicate the infiltration of a large, non indigenous group
into Canaan which coincides with the invasion of the Hebrews of Joshua's time.
This is physical, scientific evidence of an invading group, restricted to a
specific time period that is not acknowledged by some.(some claim the Hebrews
were indigenous peoples who just took over Canaan over time. The record of
deforestation tells a different story)Unfortunately many mainstream
"authorities" fail to examine the conclusions in archaeobotany, palynology and
zooarchaeology.
>   Jim, confine your arguments, such as they are, to linguistics, which is
quite obviously subjective in many instances.No more comments about the 
"rugged"
southern levant or some amateurish comments of the altitude of the hills
aboutHebron. These are painful to read they are so misinformed. Don't continue
to misinform others, particularly young people, by claiming to bean authority 
on
ancient history, to know where oaks could and couldn't grow (you made some 
claim
about few oaks in the shephelaof all things)or even the Amarna letters and 
your
confused and long outdated chronology of of Aziru.   Much has been discovered
and long accepted conclusions revised in just the past 10 years.  For everyone
else I hope this info on Ungulates and the true, wondrous condition of ancient
Palestine...south as well as north, will be of some use in future discussions
and that they will no longer be cluttered by false claims.
> Rob Acosta
>
>
>
>
> .
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