Biblical Hebrew Forum

[Yigal Levin <leviny1 AT mail.biu.ac.il>]

I would add that Latin does not have a "sh" sound either, which is why the
modern European languages that adopted the Latin alphabet had to invent a
way of writing "sh" - sh in English, ch in French, sch in German and so on.
So, Brurya, it's your no. 3.

Yigal Levin

-----Original Message-----
From: b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-hebrew-bounces AT lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of James Read
Sent: Sunday, September 06, 2009 10:12 PM
To: yodan AT yodanco.com
Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] s/sh


There is no letter sh in the Greek alphabet. The closest you can get  
is a sigma which is kind of like an 's'.

James Christian

Quoting Yodan <yodan AT yodanco.com>:

> Shalom!
>
>
>
> Has this group discussed the fact that (many? all?) names that have a SHIN
> in Hebrew are translated as S and not SH in English? Does anyone know the
> reason?
>
>
>
> I'm referring to Shaul/Saul, Shmuel/Samuel, Shlomo/Solomon, and
> Menasheh/Menasseh.
>
>
>
> Here are my thoughts but I don't know which one, if any, of the below is
> correct. Would appreciate hearing your thoughts on this.
>
>
>
> Three possibilities come to mind:
>
>
>
> 1.                   At the time of the Greek or Latin translation, which
> preceded the Masoretic nikkud ("punctuation") by centuries, these names
were
> pronounced in Hebrew with an S and only later this consonant become a SH.
So
> while Hebrew follows the Masoretic nikkud, translations represent earlier
> pronunciation of these names.
>
>
>
> 2.                   Some Jewish communities pronounced these names with
SH
> (and the Masoretic pronunciation was based on these communities) but some
> other communities pronounced them with S, and the Septuaguint or Vulgate
> translation is based on such other communities. (Remember the supposed
lisp
> of the tribe of Ephrayim, which might have not been a lisp but their way
for
> pronouncing a consonant that others pronounced SH).
>
>
>
> 3.                   At the time of the Greek or Latin translations, these
> languages did not have a SH consonant. Not knowing Greek or Latin, I don't
> know if this is the case (I'm sure some in this group know!) but it's
> possible because, as we know, European languages do not have a letter for
SH
> - it is always a combination of letters (SH in English, CH in French, and
> SCH in German). Even Hebrew doesn't have an unequivocal letter for SH -
the
> same letter serves for SHIN and SIN, depending on the location of the dot
> that wasn't there before the nikkud was invented.
>
>
>
> Thanks in advance for sharing your knowledge/thoughts.
>
>
>
> Bruryah Yodan
>
>