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  • From: peter_kirk AT sil.org
  • To: <b-hebrew AT franklin.oit.unc.edu>
  • Subject: Re[2]: Jer 7:21-23 and Amos 5:25
  • Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 11:24:06 -0500


Dear Jonathan,

Please don't take me as accusing you of undermining the Bible. I know
there are some on this list, but I don't count you among them, who
delight in seizing on any evidence of possible contradictions and
brandishing them like weapons at us evangelicals and at the more
orthodox Jews, with cries of "Aha! I told you so!" Well, they are
welcome to their point of view, and I am not trying to push an agenda
that the Bible is free from any contradictions, though I don't think
there are major ones. But I do expect everyone on the list who points
out a possible contradiction to check first the grammar of the Hebrew
passage in question to see whether it really demands interpretation as
a contradiction, or whether they have simply chosen among many possible
interpretations the one which is most suitable for their wider
arguments. I trust that you will agree that the latter alternative is
not good scholarship.

In this case my question was about whether this the grammar of this
passage in Jeremiah is evidence for contradiction, whether it demands
such an interpretation. So what is the relevance of your comments about
Amos and Job? In Job, we are talking about tensions between different
theologies, which I am well aware of, but this is a quite different
matter to the alleged contradiction of fact in Jeremiah.

If you wish to start a separate discussion on the interpretation of
Amos 5:25, you are welcome. For a start, why is this verse translated
as a question? I know it is a question in LXX. But here, in the
initial word HAZ.:BFXIYM we have (in MT) he-patah-zayin with dagesh,
which is surely normally the article rather than the interrogative he.
(According to GKC 100l, there are "about ten passages" where
interrogative he before shewa adds a dagesh, and GKC lists nine of
them not including this one.) It is perhaps odd to have the article
here but not in the following UWMINXFH, but that may simply explain
why the LXX translators got confused and made this into a question.
According to Soggin "The Prophet Amos", SCM 1987, this could be "the
exclamatory ha-, a rare form but one which is attested, Jo?on S 161b
and accepted by G. Rinaldi."

Peter Kirk


______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________
Subject: Re: Jer 7:21-23
Author: <yonsaf AT beitberl.beitberl.ac.il> at Internet
Date: 10/01/2000 19:27


peter_kirk AT sil.org wrote:

> So do we have to interpret this as Jeremiah contradicting the rest of
> scripture? Or can we use this as evidence that the Bible contradicts
> itself?

[JDSafren] Yes on both counts. On your first question, see Amos' rhetorical
ques
tion
on 5:25: "Did you offer burnt-offerings and sacrifices to me 40 years in the
des
ert, O
House of Israel?" Both prophets regard the sacrifical cult as something not
pert
aining
to the true worship of of the Lord, something alien, even pagan.
On your second question, compare the prophetic and Pentateuchal ideas of
Divine
reward
and punishment with the sentiments expressed in Job. Or take any Introduction
to
the
Study of the Hebrew Bible.
Yours,
--
Jonathan D. Safren
Dept. of Biblical Studies
Beit Berl College
Beit Berl Post Office 44905
Israel





  • Re[2]: Jer 7:21-23 and Amos 5:25, peter_kirk, 01/11/2000

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