mIEKAL aND qazingulaza at gmail.com
Fri Jun 12 16:34:16 EDT 2009

I'm pretty sure I'm on one side of the extremes.  I live in the county that
has more organic farms than any other county in the US, work for the largest
organic farmers coop in the US & the knowledge-base for going organic in
these parts is several generations deep.  On the other hand I & a lot of
people around here don't drink their well water because nitrate & atrazine
levels are too high, CAFOs are continuously trying to set up shop & there is
a fairly healthy commercial apple industry around here.  As you can imagine
doing organic apples around here has been slow going since all the apple
diseases have already set up shop in these parts.

Personally, I don't have a need to be certified organic but concentrate on
no-spray & as low inputs as possible.  Since I'm primarily making wine from
fruits, & don't sell fresh fruits I don't have to deal with having the best
looking fruit.

& in response to several past comments there is a huge amount of data that
is just appearing comparing organic to gmo, organic to commercial & USDA has
just requisitioned something like $22 million for upcoming research for
university based research projects.  A lot of anecdotal evidence will
eventually have fairly serious studies to be compared to.

This is farming country here & the incidence of pancreatic and other forms
of environmental cancers has reached alarming proportions among traditional
farming families.  I would say it is probably one of the reoccuring stories
we hear when new farmers join our coop, transitioning to organic because of
seeing members of their families picked off one by one.


On Fri, Jun 12, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Terry Bradshaw <terryb at lostmeadowvt.com>wrote:

> >
> >  Personally, I would love to see the concept of IPM agriculture blossom.
>  I would love to be able to buy IPM produce in my local grocery.  But
> somehow the concept has never gotten major attention among consumers and
> publications to consumers.  IPM is definitely the most scientific form of
> agriculture in my opinion.  It is based on the intersection of 3 realities,
> economic reality, and the knowle
> >  ge of biology and chemistry.
> Hi all, reader for many years, very infrequent poster.  I just want to
> touch on this IPM thing.  Where I am (Vermont/Northeast), and in the
> crop I work with (apples), IPM is the norm. Rare is the farmer of any
> crop who doesn't want to save a spray- it's hot, stinky, expensive
> business, spraying.  I just got off the tractor after spraying two
> blocks each of IPM and Organic apples.  Nothing went in that tank that
> wasn't economically or biologically necessary, and I'm the norm. The
> concept that it's chemical or organic with no overlap is ridiculous...I
> use compost and Bt in my IPM blocks, and scout for scab and other pests
> and spray 'natural' materials, including copper and lime sulfur, in my
> organic blocks.  If anything I find that commercial growers (I do this
> for research) are more willing to take risks than I am and skip a spray.
> The Rachel Carlson 'Sky id Falling' days are over, at least in my
> experience here.  That's not to say there aren't farms or crop that
> overuse chemicals (or on the flipside organics that ignore food safety),
> but they are the exception.  The reason the IPM brand hasn''t caught on
> is that it requires too much thought from the consumer; Organic is
> easily defined, even if it can be a hard and somewhat arbitrary line in
> the sand. Explaining economic action thresholds, insecticide classes,
> resistance management, and all on a sticker on your apple is a lot tougher.
> Thanks,
> Terry B
> Calais, VT
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