[NAFEX] nafex Digest, Vol 71, Issue 23

Webmail wynne wynne at crcwnet.com
Mon Dec 8 10:27:52 EST 2008


regarding rootstock and cultivar
 i want to know if the rootstock has any effect on the crop
production or is it totally dependent upon the characteristics of the
cultivar
sometimes one tree out of a bunch of the same everthing will really
produce much more heavily than the others, same age grafts

On 12/8/08, nafex-request at lists.ibiblio.org
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> Today's Topics:
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>    1. Re: Apricot kernels (Dr.O'Barr)
>    2. Re: Apple pressing (Claude Jolicoeur)
>    3. Re: Regarding Haskups (John S)
>    4. Re: Apple pressing (hans brinkmann)
>    5. Re: Apple pressing-hydraulic jack (hans brinkmann)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 21:39:38 -0600
> From: "Dr.O'Barr" <Topgun at Otelco.net>
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Apricot kernels
> To: "North American Fruit Explorers" <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <5899FBFDEE00443487111B1D74275B88 at RichardPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> An adult can eat 17 kernels a day with no toxicity..
>
> Topgun
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ginda Fisher" <list at ginda.us>
> To: "Martha L. Davis" <martha_davis at earthlink.net>; "North American Fruit
> Explorers" <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 9:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Apricot kernels
>
>
>>
>> On Dec 4, 2008, at 1:02 PM, Martha L. Davis wrote:
>>
>>> Stephan,
>>>
>>> "As your friendly neighborhood biochemist" How do you suggest I
>>> test apricot kernels for low amigdalyn levels?  I am grafting a
>>> variety of types, some of which are known to be sweet pit and some
>>> bitter and some unknown.  I am interested in using sweet ones as
>>> nuts, but certainly not interested in cyanide poisoning.  I know
>>> that it is possible to use heat to denature the enzyme that
>>> converts the precursor to the poison, when done on bitter pits one
>>> gets a sort of solid almond flavoring not a nut in the munchie
>>> sense, but it seems likely that that processing method isn't used
>>> on the sweet pit ones and isn't needed.  Any ideas?
>>>
>>> Martha
>>>
>>
>> Maybe this is a naive question, but wouldn't you be able to tell
>> which are "sweet" by tasting them?  I didn't think apricot kernels
>> were so toxic that tasting one carefully would be harmful.
>>
>> Ginda
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 00:37:04 -0500
> From: Claude Jolicoeur <cjoli at gmc.ulaval.ca>
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Apple pressing
> To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.20081208003704.00f51210 at pop.ulaval.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Mark wrote:
>>How did I come up with an 1 1/4" screw producing 4 tons of force with 100
>>ft.lbs of torque?  I simply used Roton's website.  For each screw they
>> sell,
>>they list the drive torque ratio, so the customer knows how much torque it
>>takes to move the load, they want to move.  For an 1 1/4" screw with 4
>>threads per inch, they list a drive torque ratio of  0.128.  Taking that
>>times a 4 ton load, gives 1024 inch lbs. of torque required.  1024 divided
>>by 12 gives 85 ft. lbs. of torque to move the force.
>
> There is approximately a 2 to 1 ratio between your drive ratio and my
> formula. This is because the screw formula takes into account the friction
> at the collar of the head while your drive ratio doesn't. The friction loss
> at the collar would be approximately the same as the one from the end of
> the screw on the plate if contact is steel on steel. I agree that if a
> thrust bearing is used, then much less torque is required than given by my
> formula.
> I think it is not easy to apply a torque exceeding 80 ft-lb on the handle
> considering the position - this would probably be the practical higher
> limit unless the press is very heavy or bolted on the floor, and the lever
> is very long.
>
> A few additional points re screw vs hydraulic cylinder:
> After using a screw for 15 years and switching to hydraulic, I found the
> following advantages with hydraulic
> -stability: the piston plate has much less tendency to tilt.
> -quick to go up - no need to unscrew all the way up.
> -no wear, no grease necessary.
> -no rotation or displacement of the press as when a large torque is applied
> to the handle.
> -very inexpensive (15$ for 4 tons). Just a thrust bearing will easily cost
> twice this price, and you still have to add the cost of the screw, nut,
> handle, plus some welding to hold things together.
>
> one point against it: the stroke is often too short and it is necessary to
> release the cylinder, add blocks, and tighten again.
>
> Claude
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 01:44:49 -0800 (PST)
> From: John S <swim_at_svc at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Regarding Haskups
> To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <719822.334.qm at web110007.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> Glad to help Glenn.? Most of my honeyberries have come from OGW.? I have
> found that there are substantial differences in flavor, productivity, form
> and vigor among the OGW honeyberry vars from them, but that it is also
> advantageous to have a variety of plants.
>
> One other comment.? I have run into people that claim to not like the
> flavor, but my personal experience is that it is tempting to harvest them
> too early.? I wait until I see a plant start to drop a few berries, before
> picking (from that plant).? This results in best flavor, which is quite
> good.
>
> Also, one of my plants insists on going dormant early each year, then throws
> a few leaves and flowers in the fall.? This year I had a single honeyberry
> harvested in late September so it wouldn't surprise me to find that we will
> eventually have a fall bearing honeyberry as well.
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 12/7/08, Glenn & Kathy Russell <GlennAndKathy2 at cox.net> wrote:
> From: Glenn & Kathy Russell <GlennAndKathy2 at cox.net>
> Subject: [NAFEX] Regarding Haskups
> To: nafex at lists.ibiblio.org
> Date: Sunday, December 7, 2008, 12:39 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi John-
>
> ??????????? Thanks
> for the info!
>
> ??????????? Although
> I?ve purchased from probably 6, and have catalogs from 12 online fruit
> nurseries, I?ve actually done much with ?One Green World?.?
> They certainly do have a lot more Honeyberries (11!) than say Raintree
> (None), Gurneys
> (2), or Burnt Ridge.? I?ve ordered a catalog from them now.
>
> ??????????? I
> think I?ll probably go with your advice (seems to make sense, and you?re
> close to me) about going with the late bloomers.? I?ll probably just
> get 1 of each of the 4 you mention.? From their online blurb (below), it
> didn?t seem to conflict with your advice.? It just seemed they were
> recommending those varieties for that area, but there?s nothing to say
> they couldn?t also work well in our area too.
>
> ??????????? Looking
> forward to having something else to eat at strawberry time!
>
> Thanks again for the info!
>
> ??????????????????????? -Glenn
>
>  ?
>
> >From One Green World:?
> While Honeyberry can be grown throughout the
>  US , some varieties have proven
> better adapted to our maritime Northwest growing conditions. The late
> blooming
> varieties Blue Velvet?, Blue Moon?, Blue Forest?, and Blue
> Pacific? set and ripen significantly more fruit in our region. The other
> varieties grow well but bloom earlier, after our short and mild winters, and
> generally set less fruit because of the lack of bees and other insects
> available for pollination.
>
>
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 11:55:48 +0100
> From: hans brinkmann <hans-brinkmann at t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Apple pressing
> To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <493CFD34.5080200 at t-online.de>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hallo Claude,
>
> your photos and your self made machines/devices are fantastic!
> The same method is used mostly at Germany!
> Additionally many small companies with your method are offering
> the special service, to press really the original juice from the
> customer's apples/fruits.
> If the customer likes, the juice is pasteurized during seconds and
> filled up.
> Finally they charge a bit more than one US $ per liter.
> For the same money you can buy juice at supermarkets.
> Few companies are offering this service also mobile - they would come to
> your place.
> The larger companies (modified method) just give you the equivalent of
> juice, but cheaper.
> They have collecting places for apples even at the smallest towns.
> The blocks of pomace are bought from animal farmers and very much from
> hunters to feed wildlife.
>
> Thank you very much!
>
> ciao hans
>
>
> Claude Jolicoeur schrieb:
>> Quite a few questions around - I will try to answer all here - Hope I
>> don't
>> forget any...
>>
>> >From David:
>>
>>> (Claude, does the French Canadian word <<cidre>> refer to sweet as well
>>> as
>>>
>> hard cider?
>>
>>> This whole concept is an American creation, dating from Prohibition, and
>>>
>> certainly in France,
>>
>>> <<le cidre>> refers unequivocally to the alcoholic beverage.)
>>>
>>
>> Everything that is not fermented should be called "juice" in my opinion.
>> "Cidre" would never be used around here for anything else than what
>> americans call hard cider.
>>
>> >From Jim:
>>
>>> What kind of fabric do you use to hold your mashed apples?  I've used
>>>
>> muzzlin (sp), a slightly heavy cotton cloth but it sometimes blows out at
>> the gaps between the vertical basket slats and there is no way it would
>> remain intact if I used it for a cheese press.
>>
>> I bought some nylon fabric, of the type used for semi-transparent drapes
>> on
>> windows. It might also be used for wedding dresses... I tried to choose
>> the
>> sturdiest one. My wife did a bit of sowing to give the shape. I have just
>> added a new picture in the album showing the cloth (it will be the last
>> picture of the album). Same link as before:
>> http://picasaweb.google.com/cjoliprsf/ApplePress
>>
>> >From Mark:
>>
>>> In short, a typical acme 1 1/4" screw will only deliver about 4 ton of
>>>
>> force, and that's with a thrust bearing, if 100 ft/lbs. of torque is
>> applied to the screw.
>>
>> I will now put my mechanical engineer's hat... The general relation for
>> torque vs axial force in a screw is:
>> Torque = 0.2 x Axial Force x Screw Diameter
>> This is a simplified, but fairly accurate, formula for standard friction
>> coefficients between screw and nut. If the diameter is in inches, you get
>> a
>> torque in inch-pounds. You need to divide by 12 to get foot-pounds.
>> Interestingly, from this formula, you would think that by taking a smaller
>> screw, you would need less torque. However, there is a minimum screw
>> diameter required in function of the axial force to keep the stress at a
>> reasonable level. Further, the longer the screw, the more chance it may
>> become unstable (this is called buckling) and the diameter has to be
>> beefed
>> up. I have a project to write an article some day on elementary press
>> mechanics, but it seems I never get the time for this...
>>
>> Claude
>>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 11:56:57 +0100
> From: hans brinkmann <hans-brinkmann at t-online.de>
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] Apple pressing-hydraulic jack
> To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <493CFD79.2080909 at t-online.de>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hallo Mark,
>
> to hang a small hydraulic jack upside down is not possible - with German
> jacks. The reason is really the oil reservoir.
> But very often I saw wonderful alternatives:  Even the smallest
> car-repair shop has a  jack to press out/in e.g. ball bearings ...
> The unit has a pressure from 5 to 10 tons,  a height from  approx. 2 m
> and a width between the  two perpendicular poles or approx. 1 m.
> The the most advantage is the foot AND handoperated hydraulic pump(what
> ever you like) at the right side.
> It could be very good to find such a used press... almost nothing must
> be changed.
>
> ciao
> hans
>
> Mark Angermayer schrieb:
>> I had a question regarding hydraulic jacks.  Has anyone ever tried to
>> hang one of these upside down?  Do they still work?  I've never torn
>> one apart to see exactly how they work.  If they have an oil resevior
>> in the bottom, the pump may not pick up the oil, if the jack is upside
>> down.  Can anyone offer any council?
>>
>> Mark
>> KS
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
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