[NAFEX] American persimmon on D. lotus rootstock & KSD

yarry lo yarrylo at hotmail.com
Thu Dec 8 16:01:36 EST 2005


Jerry,

Apologies for the lack of clarity in my previous post. My question refers to 
D. lotus as a rootstock for D. virginiana, not for D. kaki.  Also my term 
"persimmon wilt" refers not to KSD but to the fungal disease caused by 
Cephalosporium diospoyri, which had wiped out many of the native stands of 
persimmon in the southern states in the middle of the last century.
I have heard of one method of cloning D. virginiana rootstock which involves 
cutting one year old seedllings to the ground and then covering several 
inches at the base of the resulting sprouts with sawdust , which presumably 
would serve as medium for new roots.  Once these rooted they could be  cut 
from the main plant and serve as rootstocks. My attempts at this method have 
so far failed to produce any roots on the sprouts.

Alan


>From: Jwlehman at aol.com
>Reply-To: North American Fruit Explorers <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
>To: nafex at lists.ibiblio.org
>Subject: Re: [NAFEX] American persimmon on D. lotus rootstock & KSD
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>In a message dated 12/7/2005 5:34:24 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>yarrylo at hotmail.com writes:
> >
> >
> > Has anyone tried or considered D. lotus as an alternative to D. 
>virginiana
> > as a rootstock for American persimmon?
> > I understand that D. lotus is less cold hardy than D.V. but still 
>supposedly
> > hardy to zone 5, so would its use still present a hardiness problem in 
>zones
> >
> > 6 and higher?
> > Also noting some growers' observations of the significant variability of
> > persimmon variety traits on different individual D.V. rootstocks, might 
>D.
> > lotus rootstock allow a more consistent expression of the graft (as it
> > apparently
> > does for D. kaki for which it is the preferred rootstock in some 
>locations),
> > thereby possibly improving cultivar evaluations?
> > And is it reasonable to expect a somewhat dwarfed or shrubier plant to 
>grow
> > on lotus stock and would these qualities be desirable for harvesting
> > considerations?
> > Might also the naturally resistant D. lotus provide some protection from
> > persimmon wilt?
> > But back to basics, will this graft even take?!
> > Thanks
> > Alan Stein
>
>Hello Alan,
>
>Yes, there is significant variability in D. virginiana that causes problems
>comparing
>clones in test blocks. I'd also believe this would hold true for D. lotus
>seedlings. And because of having one species on another, the over all 
>variability
>may even be greater.  Strictly guessing!
>
>What we need is a method to clone Diospyros rootstocks and Purdue is 
>working
>on that and have succeeded somewhat. We could than test on uniform
>understocks. The system isn't perfected and hopefully lack of funds will 
>not halt the
>work. One plant propagator has said they would produce rootstocks if 
>invitro
>propagation is perfected.
>
>I have lotus growing here in Indiana and they freeze to the ground every
>year, except one in the past 8 years. I think maybe two are still alive. If 
>D.
>lotus were used as understock here, Zone 5b, I'd suggest the graft would 
>need be
>made low, below ground level. But then kaki would still suffer winter 
>damage
>in zone 5 and even zone 6.
>
>Yes, lotus is used as understock for kaki and recommended in the South. 
>Lotus
>is less tap rooted and have more laterals making it theoretically a better
>rootstock. I have no experience to speak from. But they are graft 
>compatible.
>Some nurseries use lotus as an understock.
>
>Have no idea if lotus would offer resistance for persimmon wilt also called
>KSD. Keep in mind this writer believes there could be more than one cause 
>or
>combination of causes for sudden death and shepherd hooking is a symptom of
>dying kaki from one or more causes.
>
>Now if KSD is caused from Manganese poising as has been speculated, then
>lotus could be a preventative if the uptake of Manganese is less than with
>virginiana or kaki as I've seen reports that kaki on kaki can also exhibit 
>KSD.
>
>We know some varieties within a given species have more resistance to 
>certain
>viruses. For example, at the USDA, Beltsville, where they test incoming 
>plant
>material for viruses one of the first steps is graft Prunus to virus
>sensitive rootstocks. If the rootstock dies, the material is virus 
>infected. No need
>to test further. If one of the causes of KSD is a virus then virginiana 
>must be
>tolerant of it. Would lotus impart resistance to grafted kaki? Have no 
>idea.
>Virginiana certainly doesn't seem to and acts more like a carrier.  See 
>Lester
>Davis input on the subject 12/02/05, subject title: Kaki sex.
>
>There you have it, much verbiage, no conclusion.
>
>Jerry


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