[b-hebrew] Fw: Job 38:8 ??

K Randolph kwrandolph at gmail.com
Sun Dec 9 01:54:27 EST 2012


On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 5:52 PM, Will Parsons <wbparsons at alum.mit.edu> wrote:

> Karl,
> This will *probably* be my last post on this subject, since I fear
> that we risk the wrath of the moderators for writing too much on Greek
> and Coptic, and not enough on Hebrew...

Yes, we are getting into the theoretical side of other languages, and not
concentrating on those factors that are germain to the question.

> On Sat, 8 Dec 2012 12:42:03 -0800, K Randolph <kwrandolph at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Will:
> >
> > On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 10:59 AM, Will Parsons <wbparsons at alum.mit.edu
> >wrote:
> >...
> > Just because Dionysios Thrax who was trying to make a description of
> > classical Greek for a Koiné speaking audience claimed that “ks” was not a
> > phoneme, did the man on the street who was writing phonemically agree
> with
> > him? Or even the man on the street writing pre-classical Greek agree with
> > him? I think not.
> I haven't been offered a trip back in time in the tardis to interview
> the "man in the street" in ancient Greece, so Dionysios Thrax is my
> best approximation.  Speculating that the ordinary ancient Greek would
> have seen things differently is, well, speculation.

The important thing for this discussion, how was it pronounced? Even
Dionysios Thrax indicates that it was the same as the English phoneme “X”.

> >
> > But it does represent a change in pronunciation, which argues against
> your
> > claim.
> A change in pronunciation - how so?  There was no change in
> pronunciation in going from /k/ + /s/ to /ks/.

Then why did you bring up this side argument in the first place?

Then this whole argument whether the Greeks considered this a phoneme or
not is irrelevant to the question of whether or not Samekh was originally
pronounced as an “X”. I thought the whole reason you brought up the
question of whether or not the ancient Greeks considered Xi a phoneme was
because you were making an argument that the pronunciation was changed. But
if the pronunciation is unchanged, then that question is irrelevant.

The same with the other letters representing sounds that were never found
in Biblical Hebrew.

> --
> Will Parsons
> μη φαινεσθαι, αλλ' ειναι.

Karl W. Randolph.
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