[b-hebrew] Definite Article 7:14 - HNH
hholmyard3 at earthlink.net
Sat Jul 21 12:27:48 EDT 2007
> "14. Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the
> young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name
> " הָרָה " = "is pregnant"
> This is the perfect tense.
HH: It is not the perfect tense.
הָרָה HRH is not even a verb but an adjective. The verb has to be supplied
and could be either present or future (or past).
> You can once again do "Does not necessarily", "it
> could" as even The Rashi
> takes it here as imperfect (I think because of the prophecy connection) but
> for your benefit and Karl's
> if we go by examples in the Hebrew Bible, this construction is usually the
> So now, regarding the offending word in 7:14, we have the nearby Textual
> Markers of:
> HNH = Here is
> HRH = Is pregnant
HH: Here is another issue with your thought process. If you put these
together, you would have:
"Here is the virgin is pregnant." That makes no sense. So you better
stick with "Behold" for your theory.
> All completely consistent with a young woman who is not only known to Isaiah
> and Ahaz but physically present.
HH: Yes, it is possible.
> The HRH could even be physically noticeable
> (this would fit the larger context of a "forced" prophecy.
HH: Yes, this is possible.
> You would agree
> that it's forced on Ahaz. That may not be the limit of it's forcefulness).
> Consider that the two nearest Textual Markers support a physical presence
> Harold, your indefinite translation is looking merely like a possible one at
> this point.
HH: Yes, of course, I explained what I thought was probable. I did not
> One that could not possibly be likely, even in your opinion, as to
> this point you always have to use minority meanings. You need a miracle in
> the larger context to Save your meaning.
HH: No, I don't need a miracle. I do need a prophecy of the future in
the larger context to save my meaning. But that is exactly what we have.
> "HNH does not have to
> imply anything about physical presence. In the verse HNH is drawing
> attention to what a/the virgin will do, not to the presence of the virgin."
> HRH is a very physical sign and a very common one in the Hebrew Bible as
> evidence of
> God's mysterious power and presence in human affairs (so to speak).
HH: What I said is true, and what you said is true. But there are so
many cases where HRH does not refer to something physically present that
your point carries no argumentative weight for Isa 7:14, at least for me.
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