[b-hebrew] Samson at Gaza - Judges 16:1

Jerry Shepherd jerry.shepherd at taylor-edu.ca
Tue Aug 14 11:12:58 EDT 2007


Hi George

I appreciate this slight corrective to your earlier post.  Perhaps
"profligate" was too harsh a word to use in the commentary you referred
to.  But, of course, he was no paragon of virtue either.  And I still
think he is part of the picture that the author of Judges paints of
deteriorating leadership, the "downward spiral."

Blessings,

Jerry

Dr. Jerry E. Shepherd
Associate Professor of Old Testament
Taylor Seminary
11525 - 23 Avenue
Edmonton, AB T6J 4T3
CANADA
Office: (780)431-5250
Home: (780)434-1164
Fax: (780)436-9416
Email: jerry.shepherd at taylor-edu.ca
Internet: http://www.taylor-edu.ca 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: b-hebrew-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-hebrew-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of George Athas
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2007 12:41 AM
To: b-hebrew at lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Samson at Gaza - Judges 16:1

The NT sees Samson as a 'hero of faith'. See Hebrews 11.32.
 
My impression is that the Judges narrative paints Samson as a flawed
character, but it does the same for others like Jephthah and Gideon. In
that
regard, these three judges, for whom we have extended narratives, are
all in
the same basket. I note that Hebrews 11.32 also mentions Gideon and
Jephthah
(and also Barak).
 

Best Regards, 

GEORGE ATHAS 
Moore Theological College (Sydney) 
1 King St, Newtown, NSW 2042, Australia 
Ph: (+61 2) 9577 9774 


-----Original Message-----
From: b-hebrew-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-hebrew-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Calvin
Lindstrom
Sent: Tuesday, 14 August 2007 6:52 AM
To: B Hebrew <b-hebrew at lists.ibiblio.org>
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Samson at Gaza - Judges 16:1
Importance: Low


James Jordan has a very interesting commentary on Judges that goes  
against the typical Protestant and pietistic view.

It is available at:

http://www.entrewave.com/freebooks/docs/21ee_47e.htm

Calvin Lindstrom
Church of Christian Liberty
Arlington Heights, IL
www.christianliberty.com




On Aug 13, 2007, at 3:21 PM, Dave Washburn wrote:

>
> On Mon, August 13, 2007 12:47 pm, Yigal Levin wrote:
>> Dear Bruce,
>>
> [snip]
>> Your comment about "Christendom paints Samson as a bad man" is
>> interesting.
>> How representative is that statement of different Christian  
>> denominations.
> [snip]
>
> It's pretty thoroughly representative from what I've seen.  Most
> Christian-based commentaries paint him as a failure in his mission,  
> and
> see women as the cause of his downfall.  I disagree wholeheartedly,  
> and in
> 1992 I presented a paper to the ETS annual meeting arguing that  
> Samson's
> problem wasn't lust, but loneliness.  As for his mission, the  
> oracle his
> father is said to have received said he would "begin to" deliver  
> Israel
> from the Philistine oppression; I see this as setting things up for  
> the
> rise of the davidic dynasty which ultimately (according to the  
> text) threw
> off the Philistine yoke and established an independent kingdom.   
> Viewed in
> this wider context, his mission wasn't a failure at all.
>
> However, I'm far from representative of the average Christian  
> commentator.
>  It's much more common to see him described in terms such as "the
> profligate judge" as one commentary put it.
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Bruce Prince" <bruceprince at bigpond.com>
>> To: "b-Hebrew List" <b-hebrew at lists.ibiblio.org>
>> Sent: Monday, August 13, 2007 10:18 PM
>> Subject: [b-hebrew] Samson at Gaza - Judges 16:1
>>
>>
>>> Folks
>>>
>>> Not being very good at understanding the intricate details of  
>>> Biblical
>>> Hebrew, I'm wondering if you can help me understand what is going  
>>> on in
>>> this
>>> verse?
>>>
>>> Generally, Christendom paints Samson as a bad man, but I'm not
>>> convinced.
>>> Even whilst staying in Gaza, the power of the Lord was upon him  
>>> as he
>>> heaved
>>> those massive gates out of their foundation and up the hill. God's
>>> purpose
>>> for Samson was to rile the Philistines - a task he seemed  
>>> particularly
>>> adapted to.
>>>
>>> Samson's reputation had gone before him to this city, and I'm  
>>> wondering
>>> if
>>> he was simply using the home of the harlot as a place of abode in  
>>> much
>>> the
>>> same way that the spies used Rahab's home in Jericho.
>>>
>>> Does the Hebrew of this verse undeniably state that Samson had
>>> intercourse
>>> with the harlot? Verse 3 states that he lay until midnight; it  
>>> doesn't
>>> say
>>> that he lay with her.
>>>
>>> I'd appreciate any views.
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Bruce Prince
>>> Australia
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> b-hebrew mailing list
>>> b-hebrew at lists.ibiblio.org
>>> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-hebrew
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>
>
> -- 
> Dave Washburn
> Why do it right when you can do it again?
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