[b-hebrew] Dying, you will die Gen 2:17

Shoshanna Walker rosewalk at concentric.net
Wed Apr 11 00:55:36 EDT 2007

So what do I, or any of us Jews who spend our time observing Torah 
and learning it as best we can, each to our own ability, care what 
Peter says?

And I don't know what Hebrew or other schools you attended, or what 
they taught you, or what their strengths or deficiencies in education 
were, or that of your family, or what college, or what rabbis you 
talked to, that is not my responsibility.

And what, are you asking ME to give you exact sources, verses, in all 
of Talmud, Midrash, Mishna, Kabbala, Rashi, Rambam, Ramban, Radak, 
Zohar, Ramchal, Arizal, and all of the Neviim, and Shoftim, and 
Tannaim and Rishonim and Acharonim, etc., etc., etc., all of the 
transmitters of Mesorah, which we know exactly who each and every one 
of them were, in every generation, - you are asking ME to prove to 
you that there is Torah She'B'al Peh which was given to Moshe 
together with Torah She'B'chtav, and was even given to Adam HaRishon, 
after he repented for three days, and transmitted from him to every 
worthy person in every generation (How did Noach know which were the 
"clean, ie' kosher, animals before the Torah was given to us formally 
as a People, which the Torah records that he took seven of those, and 
two of all the rest into the Teiva? - and how, by the way, do you 
think that he managed all of them, without being able to communicate 
with them, and in order to do that, from Whom do you think he got 
that little bit of information?) just because of the deficiency of 
your Jewish education?

If you truly want to know, you will seek til you find the answer, it 
is not my job to educate you.  Or maybe you can just read Torah and 
some basic Commentaries seriously.

They didn't have to claim it - they didn't have to prove themselves 
to ignoramuses like me and you - they were living, breathing, 
sleeping Torah!  They were working to perfect themselves, their 
personal attributes, their devotions, etc. for this one and only 
purpose - to become worthy to know Torah, in its depths, as deep as 
they were qualified to learn.  Who would EVER question them as you 

If you want to know, you have to study Torah, it is not MY burden of proof.

> From: Shoshanna Walker
> Romans is not the word of G-d, it doesn't even allege that.
[Steve Miller]
2 Peter 3:16 says that Paul's writings are Scripture.

Thank you for writing. Where do the Talmud, Mishnah and Rashi commentaries
claim to be the word of God?

I was raised Orthodox and went to Hebrew school and Hebrew college, and I
was not taught that the Talmud, Mishnah or Rashi were part of the word of
God. My mother told us that the Talmud was written by sages much wiser than
us, but we did not believe that it was the word of God like the Tanach is.
I have talked to many rabbis, and I have never met any who believe like you
seem to, that Rashi's commentary is the authoritative explanation of the

Here is a previous post on the subject by Yitzhak Saphir:
>>The idea that there is an oral law equally as authoritative as the
>>written law is highly dubious to me. You say that this prevents
>>mistranslation, but it allows the importation of every kind of merely
>>human idea and even perversion of God's word. God warns against adding
>>to his word, and a proposed "oral law" does just that. It presents
>>something as having the same authority as the written word, from what
>>you say, and thereby adds to God's word.

>However, Shoshanna's interpretation of Rashi and Midrash as part of this
>oral law is not shared by all Jews.  It is an extreme interpretation that
>essentially says that Rashi or the Rabbis of the Midrash whom he often
>quotes was not a great scholar but simply a scribe who wrote something
>handed down to him from the days of Moses.  While that may describe
>much of his work (much of Rashi is effectively quotes from the Midrash),
>he was also a great scholar and a true understanding of Rashi can only
>be achieved by seeing all his quoted sources (which are many!) and
>identifying which parts he chose to quote, which he chose not to quote,
>what he chose to add of his own, and answering why he chose to do what
>he did.

-Steve Miller

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