[b-hebrew] Ayin and Ghayin

B. M. Rocine brocine at twcny.rr.com
Fri Oct 7 17:08:53 EDT 2005

Hi Karl,

 From your wordy post to Yitzak, it seems that you do not understand 
that one of the few ways we *attempt* to reconstruct ancient 
pronunciations of one language is by examining transcriptions of that 
language into a contemporary language.

May I suggest some basic reading in case you haven't already had a 
chance:  Saenz-Badillow, Angel.  _A History of the Hebrew Language_, 
Cambridge: Cambridge University, 1993.

One other thing:  In your post you demand "documentation" from before 
the 6th century BC that shin/sin could be differentiated.  Are you 
serious?  You can't mean that you want some ancient philologist to have 
written a certificate of such information.  You must mean "evidence" or 
"testimony"...except that Yitzak presented you with just such evidence, 
and you do not receive it.

I concur with Kirk's motion to end the thread.


Karl Randolph wrote:
> Yitzhak:
> I have already answered the problem with the 
> execration texts, I will go into more detail here.

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Yitzhak Sapir" <yitzhaksapir at gmail.com>
>>I had brought evidence from the Execration Texts regarding the 
>>sh/th difference:
>>As for Shin/Sin, Daniel Sivan's and Ziporah Cochavi-Rainey's "West Semitic
>>Vocabulary in Egyptian Script of the 14th to the 10th centuries BCE" notes:
>>Semitic & is represented in Egyptian by signs with s' and s, eg:
>>(a-s'-bu in GN [39, cf Heb (es'eb, Arabic (u$bu].
>>s'a'-(a'-ru' "hair" [187, cf Heb &e(ar, Arabic $a(r, $a(ar]
>>For further information and Bibliography see Sivan "Grammatical Analysis and
>>Glossary of the Northwest Semitic Vocables in Akkadian Texts of the 15th-13th
>>centuries BC from Canaan and Syria", AOAT 214.
>>Semitic $ is expressed by Egyptian with $, eg.
>>ma-$:-)ab "scoop" (117) from *$)B
>>Ma-$a-)-la GN (Thut III, 39) Heb Mi$)al < Canaanite *Ma$)al
>>(a'-$a-q "to oppress" (40), Heb (a$aq, Arabic (a$aqa.
>>Does this suffice?
>>Yitzhak Sapir

B. M. Rocine
Living Word Chruch
6101 Court St. Rd.
Syracuse, NY 13026
(W): 315.437.6744

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