[b-hebrew] Job 1:8; 2:3

Harold R. Holmyard III hholmyard at ont.com
Fri Aug 5 23:08:48 EDT 2005

Dear Charles,

>  > >>Dave Washburn
>>  >>Actually, when God asks Satan "have you considered my servant
>>  >>Job?  Look how
>>  >>great he is. Makes your blood boil, doesn't it?????"  (my paraphrase,
>>  >>obviously) it almost appears that God is taunting Satan, daring
>>  >>him to make
>>  >>an accusation.  In both chapters, it is God, not Satan, who
>>  brings up the
>>  >>subject of Job.  What do you do with that?
>>  >>
>>  >Charles D. Rempel
>>  >Actually the Hebrew says, "Have you set your heart on my servant Job?" A
>>  >little different perspective then is implied by the English translation.
>>  > D. Jim West
>>  True- but in a woodenly literalistic way.  Or are you suggesting that
>>  satan pulled out his heart and placed it on job or that that was what
>>  god was asking?  of course not- its an idiomatic phrase- quite correctly
>>  rendered in english by "considered" in this context.  further- you say
>>  "the Hebrew says... " and then you give an english translation.  In
>>  point of fact the Hebrew doesn't say anything in English, it says it in
>>  Hebrew.  More correctly you should have said, "the hebrew suggests an
>>  english translation which would go something like this....."  I realize
>>  that sound pedantic- and in a way it is- but its precision we should
>>  strive for- and since that is what youve asked of Dave, that's what
>>  should be required of you.
>Actually, I had never considered the totally 
>literal thought of taking ones heart out and 
>"setting" it anywhere. While idiomatically it 
>may well be that "considered" is a good 
>translation, there is a possible inference that 
>God is approaching Satan and bringing up the 
>topic. I think that "what the Hebrew suggests" 
>is that Satan had already carefully "considered" 
>Job and therefore, in good English idiom, "set 
>his heart" on testing Job.

HH: Dave seems right that the phrase &M LB means 
to "consider," not "have a desire for" or 
something like that. That is what my own 
experience has taught, and a quick check of 
places where the verb and noun stand together 
support that subjective sense. In the following 
verses, all that I found in the search, the 
phrase always (7x) signifies something like 

Ex. 9:21 And the one who did not pay attention to 
the word of the LORD left his servants and his 
cattle in the field.
Is. 41:22  "Bring in [your idols] to tell us what 
is going to happen. Tell us what the former 
things were, so that we may consider them and 
know their final outcome. Or declare to us the 
things to come,
Ezek. 40:4 The man said to me,  "Son of man, look 
with your eyes and hear with your ears and pay 
attention to everything I am going to show you, 
for that is why you have been brought here. Tell 
the house of Israel everything you see."
Ezek. 44:5 ¶ The LORD said to me,  "Son of man, 
look carefully, listen closely and give attention 
to everything I tell you concerning all the 
regulations regarding the temple of the LORD. 
Give attention to the entrance of the temple and 
all the exits of the sanctuary.
Job 1:8 ¶ Then the LORD said to Satan,  "Have you 
considered my servant Job? There is no one on 
earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a 
man who fears God and shuns evil."
Job 2:3 ¶ Then the LORD said to Satan,  "Have you 
considered my servant Job? There is no one on 
earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a 
man who fears God and shuns evil. And he still 
maintains his integrity, though you incited me 
against him to ruin him without any reason."

					Harold Holmyard

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