[B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format

Ken Penner kpenner at stfx.ca
Sat Jun 11 12:14:41 EDT 2011


In Firefox, the equivalent option is in "Tools," "Options," "Content," "Advanced...," "Allow pages to choose their own fonts, instead of my selections above" off. Then set the fonts above it to ones you know can display polytonic Greek.
Ken


Ken M. Penner, Ph.D.
Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic vocabulary memorization software:
http://purl.org/net/kmpenner/flash/ 
kpenner at stfx.ca




-----Original Message-----
From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org [mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Michael Baber
Sent: June-11-11 9:39 AM
To: Jason Hare
Cc: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format

Or, you could just select "Ignore font styles specified on web pages" in "Tools," "Internet Options," "General," and "Accessibility." Michael G. Baber illuminatiaries at yahoo.com
 

From: Jason Hare <jason at thehebrewcafe.com>
To: "b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org" <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2011 5:43 AM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format

And here's the rub. B-Greek's forum software is set up using Cascading Style Sheets (CSS), and the font definitions are as Ken has written below. What this means is that when your browser draws up the page, it should (for the message text) first try to use Lucida Grande. If your system doesn't have that font, it will look for Trebuchet MS. If that's not there or doesn't support all of Greek, it will search for Verdana, and on down.

Lucida Grande has only monotonic support for Greek.
Trebuchet MS is the same. It doesn't have polytonic symbols.
The same is the case with Verdana and Helvetica.

So, the system has to look through four fonts that do not have full Greek support before it reaches Arial and the catch-all "sans-serif"
to find the polytonic characters. I've requested on Textkit (which uses the same forum software and basic stylesheet) that someone would adjust the fonts so that we could skip all of these fonts that don't support Greek, but no one ever did it.

On my system, I get all of the standard characters in the font Trebuchet MS, and the diactrical characters appear in Arial. It's kinda ugly, but I've gotten used to it because of Textkit.

Someone should rewrite the stylesheet definitions to include only Unicode-compliant fonts. It would eliminate the awkward appearance of Trebuchet or Verdana letters next to Arial letters. Though I don't see why anyone's browser (as long as it's up-to-date) would not display all of the characters in some sans-serif font. Even my telephone (Android 2.0) displays polytonic Greek perfectly.

Best regards,
Jason Hare


On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 7:36 PM, Ken Penner <kpenner at stfx.ca> wrote:
>
> The font used on the B-Greek forum is the first installed font from the following lists:
>
> Headings:
> "Trebuchet MS",Verdana,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;
> Message text:
> "Lucida Grande","Trebuchet MS",Verdana,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;
> Quoted text:
> "Lucida Grande","Trebuchet MS",Verdana,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;
> Message list:
> "Trebuchet MS",Helvetica,Arial,Sans-serif;
>
> You may therefore experience boxes if you do not have Trebuchet MS or Lucida Grande installed on your computer, and you are not using a browser smart enough to swap in the missing characters from another font (I think Firefox will).
>
> Ken
>
>
> Ken M. Penner, Ph.D.
> Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic vocabulary memorization software:
> http://purl.org/net/kmpenner/flash/
> kpenner at stfx.ca
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org 
> [mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Bryant J. 
> Williams III
> Sent: June-10-11 3:28 AM
> To: George F Somsel; Carl Conrad; David Fish
> Cc: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format
>
> Dear George,
>
> I tried the following on the B-Greek Forum. In each case the epsilon, eta, omega and upsilon would not appear correctly. In the MS Word documents they would appear correctly. The difference may be that each below is TrueTypeFont versus PolytonicFont. Even then, I have not have had problems with the Unicode listed fonts.
>
> Arial Unicode MS
> BiblialS
> Charis SIL
> Ezra SIL
> Galatia SIL
> Galaxie Unicode
> Lucinda Sans Unicode
> SPIonic
> New Athena Unicode
> Tahoma
> Verdana
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: George F Somsel
>  To: Bryant J. Williams III ; Carl Conrad ; David Fish
>  Cc: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
>  Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 10:50 PM
>  Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format
>
>
>  It really shouldn't matter.  Unicode is unicode is unicode so long as the language is covered by a font.
>
>
>  george
>  gfsomsel
>
>
>
>  … search for truth, hear truth,
>  learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
>  defend the truth till death.
>
>
>
>  - Jan Hus
>  _________
>
>
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --------
>  From: Bryant J. Williams III <bjwvmw at com-pair.net>
>  To: Carl Conrad <cwconrad2 at mac.com>; David Fish <dfish at occ.edu>
>  Cc: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
>  Sent: Thu, June 9, 2011 9:25:30 PM
>  Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format
>
>  Dear Carl,
>
>  [Carl said]
>  Of course, over at the new site 
> (http://ibiblio.org/bgreek/forum/index.php),
>  where all sorts of things are happening, BG Transliteration is no 
> longer needed;
>  we use Unicode there.
>
>  [Bryant asks]
>  Which Unicode font is being used? I have tried to use several 
> different ones and
>  still seeing the little "rectangular" boxes on some of the letters.
>
>  En Xristiwi,
>
>  Rev. Bryant J. Williams III
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: "Carl Conrad" <cwconrad2 at mac.com>
>  To: "David Fish" <dfish at occ.edu>
>  Cc: <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
>  Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 2:35 PM
>  Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1st century e-mail format
>
>
>  >
>  > On Jun 9, 2011, at 4:04 PM, David Fish wrote:
>  >
>  > > Shirley Rollinson wrote:
>  > > υμινσπουδηναλλααπολογιαναλλααγ
>  > >
>  
> ανακτησιναλλαφοβοναλλαεπιποθησιναλλαζηλοναλλαεκδικησινπαντισυνεστησατε
> εαυτουςαγν
>  ουςειναιεντωπραγματι
>  > >
>  > > I was thinking it should be more like this:
>  > >
>  > >
>  
> ΥΜΙΝΣΠΟΥΔΗΝΑΛΛΑΑΠΟΛΟΓΙΑΝΑΛΛΑΑΓΑΝΑΚΤΗΣΙΝΑΛΛΑΦΟΒΟΝΑΛΛΑΕΠΙΠΟΘΗΣΙΝΑΛΛΑΖΗΛΟ
> ΝΑΛΛΑΕΚΔΙΚ
>  ΗΣΙΝΠΑΝΤΙΣΥΝΕΣΤΗΣΑΤΕΕΑΥΤΟΥΣΑΓΝΟΥΣΕΙΝΑΙΕΝΤΩΠΡΑΓΜΑΤΙ
>  > >
>  > > Please don't ask me to type that in B-Greek transliteration mode.
>  > >
>  > > :),
>  >
>  > It's easy with the Hopperizer which converts Unicode to 
> BG-Transliteration
>  (http://www.katabiblon.com/tools/perseus-hopperizer/)
>  >
>  
> UMINSPOUDHNALLAAPOLOGIANALLAAGANAKTHSINALLAFOBONALLAEPIPOQHSINALLAZHLO
> NALLAEKDIK
>  HSINPANTISUNESTHSATEEAUTOUSAGNOUSEINAIENTWPRAGMATI
>  >
>  > Of course, over at the new site 
> (http://ibiblio.org/bgreek/forum/index.php),
>  where all sorts of things are happening, BG Transliteration is no 
> longer needed;
>  we use Unicode there.
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Carl W. Conrad
>  > Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > ---
>  > B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
>  > B-Greek mailing list
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>  >
>
>
>  
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>
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>
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>  B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
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