[B-Greek] Mark 7:18-19

Carl Conrad cwconrad2 at mac.com
Sat Oct 31 08:22:02 EDT 2009


On Oct 31, 2009, at 7:06 AM, John Sanders wrote:

> My own thoughts on this passage is that καθαριζον  
> (KAQARIZON) is probably
> the original term used.  Beginning with verse 18 there are two οτι  
> (OTI)
> clauses, the second beginning with verse 19 and ending with the word
> εκπορευεται (EKPOREUETAI).  The clause καθαιζον  
> παντα τα βρωματα (KAUARIZON
> PANTA TA BRWMATA) is the concluding phrase summing up the food law.
> Beginning with verse 20 the conversation now emphasizes what is truly
> unclean.  In other words, βρωματα (BRWMATA) is ορθο  
> (nominative) plural
> construing with a verb in the singular.  I know that the participal  
> is not a
> true verb in that sense, but I suspect it will perform accordingly in
> speech.

Neuter nominative plural construing with a finite singular verb is one  
thing, but neuter plural noun construing with a neuter singular  
participle is hardly conceivable, a solecism of the first order (cf.  
BDF §136).

This troublesome passage has been discussed before, and in checking  
through the archives I find my own take on this passage set forth in  
1997 (http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek/archives/97-03/0886.html) and also  
in my "Brief Commentary on the Gospel of Mark" (http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~cwconrad/Mark/ 
).. I think that KAQARIZWN with -W-, the nominative masculine form in  
agreement with IHSOUS as the implicit subject as of LEGEI in verse 18.  
I won't reproduce that 1997 message here, as it was composed before  
our current restricted parameters of list-discussion were formulated.  
I would agree with George here, that KAQARIZWN the nominative  
masculine participle is grammatically proper here, although its  
position at such great removal from the main clause with which it must  
construe is extremely awkward.

Carl W. Conrad

> On Sat, Oct 31, 2009 at 4:17 PM, Leonard Jayawardena <leonardj at live.com 
> >wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> Donald Cobb wrote:
>>
>> Quote
>>
>> If we retained the neutral KAQARIZON, I would find it extremely  
>> difficult,
>> in terms of meaning, to connect it with PAN TO EKSWTHEN in v. 18 or  
>> with the
>> understood subject of the verbs in v. 19: "For it enters... into  
>> the bellly
>> and goes out into the latrine, purifying all foods". IMO, the  
>> sentence thus
>> understood is nonsensical; can we say that the food that enters,  
>> etc.,
>> pronounces all foods clean?
>>
>> I don't think that turning into a question, as does NA, gives a good
>> meaning, either.
>>
>> If we chose to retain the neutral, I think we would have to  
>> understand the
>> subject as an unexpressed relative, hO, hOTI or something along  
>> those lines,
>> and paraphrase: "This statement of Jesus pronounced all foods pure."
>>
>> Unquote
>>
>> LJ: With regard to the past para., cannot the antecedent of the  
>> participle
>> (if "antecedent" is the correct term) be taken as the whole thought
>> expressed by the words from PAN TO EXWQEN to EKPOREUETAI, so that  
>> the idea
>> is that the biological process described by these words purifies  
>> the food
>> consumed? (The meaning is still nonsensical, of course, as I have  
>> explained
>> in my last post.)
>>
>> This would be analagous to the idea expressed by a clause/s  
>> sometimes being
>> the antecedent of a relative pronoun in English, as in the sentence  
>> "The
>> crowd went berserk and started smashing property, which compelled the
>> authorities to send in the riot police."
>>
>> Is a similar phenomenon occurring in Mark 7:19 with the neuter  
>> participle
>> KAQARIZON?
>>
>>
>> Leonard Jayawardena
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> -- 
> John Sanders
> Suzhou, China
> ---
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