[B-Greek] Matthew 26:64 συ ειπας

Bryant J. Williams III bjwvmw at com-pair.net
Fri Oct 23 20:54:28 EDT 2009


Dear List,

Would it not be better to understand an implied EINAI, in this instance ESTIN,
come before SU EIPAS? It would therefore say, "It is as you said; furthermore
(PLHN) I say to you ...

En Xristwi,

Rev. Bryant J. Williams III
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Elizabeth Kline" <kline_dekooning at earthlink.net>
To: "Cornell Machiavelli" <cornellmachiavelli at yahoo.com>
Cc: <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Friday, October 23, 2009 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Matthew 26:64 συ ειπας


>
> On Oct 22, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Cornell Machiavelli wrote:
>
> > How would we understand συ ειπας here? Does the use of
> > πλην shortly thereafter help us determine the contrast between
> > the answer (first clause) and the following clause? In fact, why the
> > use of PLHN here?
>
> the text again
>
> Matt. 26:63 ὁ δὲ Ἰησοῦς ἐσιώπα. καὶ ὁ
> ἀρχιερεὺς εἶπεν αὐτῷ· ἐξορκίζω σε
> κατὰ τοῦ θεοῦ τοῦ ζῶντος ἵνα ἡμῖν
> εἴπῃς εἰ σὺ εἶ ὁ χριστὸς ὁ υἱὸς
> τοῦ θεοῦ.  64 λέγει αὐτῷ ὁ Ἰησοῦς·
> σὺ εἶπας. πλὴν λέγω ὑμῖν· ἀπ᾿ ἄρτι
> ὄψεσθε τὸν υἱὸν τοῦ ἀνθρώπου
> καθήμενον ἐκ δεξιῶν τῆς δυνάμεως
> καὶ ἐρχόμενον ἐπὶ τῶν νεφελῶν τοῦ
> οὐρανοῦ.  65 τότε ὁ ἀρχιερεὺς
> διέρρηξεν τὰ ἱμάτια αὐτοῦ λέγων·
> ἐβλασφήμησεν· τί ἔτι χρείαν ἔχομεν
> μαρτύρων; ἴδε νῦν ἠκούσατε τὴν
> βλασφημίαν·  66 τί ὑμῖν δοκεῖ; οἱ δὲ
> ἀποκριθέντες εἶπαν· ἔνοχος θανάτου
> ἐστίν..
> .
> MATT. 26:63 hO DE IHSOUS ESIWPA. KAI hO ARCIEREUS EIPEN AUTWi·
> EXORKIZW SE KATA TOU QEOU TOU ZWNTOS hINA hHMIN EIPHiS EI SU EI hO
> CRISTOS hO hUIOS TOU QEOU. 64 LEGEI AUTWi hO IHSOUS· SU EIPAS. PLHN
> LEGW hUMIN· AP᾿ ARTI OYESQE TON hUION TOU ANQRWPOU KAQHMENON EK
> DEXIWN THS DUNAMEWS KAI ERCOMENON EPI TWN NEFELWN TOU OURANOU. 65 TOTE
> hO ARCIEREUS DIERRHXEN TA hIMATIA AUTOU LEGWN· EBLASFHMHSEN· TI ETI
> CREIAN ECOMEN MARTURWN; IDE NUN HKOUSATE THN BLASFHMIAN· 66 TI hUMIN
> DOKEI; hOI DE APOKRIQENTES EIPAN· ENOCOS QANATOU ESTIN.
> .
>
> The search of TLG-E seems to indicate that SU EIPAS in answer to a
> question was NOT an established greek idiom. I appears to function in
> the passion narratives as a means for throwing a question back at
> questioner without giving a definite answer. The particle PLHN is used
> to sweep aside the question without further comment on it and refocus
> on some other issue. It probably implies here that the framing of the
> question and assumptions of hO ARCIEREUS made either a yes or no
> response unacceptable because the question itself was imbedded a
> complex set of assumptions (cognitive framework) which Jesus didn't
> accept. The particle PLHN does not always imply a simple negation of
> previous statement.
> .
> 65 TOTE hO ARCIEREUS DIERRHXEN TA hIMATIA AUTOU LEGWN· EBLASFHMHSEN·
> TI ETI CREIAN ECOMEN MARTURWN; IDE NUN HKOUSATE THN BLASFHMIAN
> .
> The response of hO ARCIEREUS to Jesus answer does not tell us at what
> point in Jesus reply the EBLASFHMHSEN occurred. It seems highly
> probable that the EBLASFHMHSEN charge was focused on the words after
> PLHN, specifically KAQHMENON EK DEXIWN THS DUNAMEWS KAI ERCOMENON EPI
> TWN NEFELWN TOU OURANOU. For a detailed discussion of this see D.Bock
> [2000 p200].
>
> The commentaries I checked, R.T.France (Matt, 2007),  A.Plummer (Matt.
> 1909?), L.Morris (Matt. 1992) all agreed that SU EIPAS is ambiguous.
>
> Elizabeth Kline
>
> [1] Bock, Darrell L. Blasphemy and exaltation in Judaism and the final
> examination of Jesus : a philological-historical study of the key
> Jewish themes impacting Mark 14:61-64 / Darrell L. Bock. Tübingen :
> Mohr Siebeck, c1998. xiv, 285 p. ; 24 cm. ISBN 3-16-147052-4 [Baker
> Academic  2000 reprint]
>
>
> ---
> B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
> B-Greek mailing list
> B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek
>


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