[B-Greek] The Article / Was Zechariah 8:3 (LXX)

Albert Pietersma albert.pietersma at sympatico.ca
Tue Oct 13 23:47:53 EDT 2009


To answer your closing question, examples of "good Greek" in the Bible  
(or outside of it) are to be found in texts which can be assumed to  
represent straightforward use of the Greek language. In other words,  
one would turn to COMPOSITION literature rather than to TRANSLATION  
literature.
Since, judging by its textual-linguistic make-up, the LXX typically  
shows itself to be heavily influenced by its source text, it cannot be  
ASSUMED that the LXX represents straightforward use of language.  
Straightforward use of language, therefore, must be DEMONSTRATED  
rather than assumed.
The obvious examples of "good Greek" within the LXX are the books that  
were COMPOSED in Greek. For the rest, in grammaticography as well as  
in lexicography, the rule is: QUOD DEMONSTRANDUM EST.
Al



On Oct 13, 2009, at 9:31 PM, Stephen Baldwin wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Ladies and Gentlemen:
> Leonard's question coincides with a small amount of reading I've  
> been doing=
> in Wallace [GGBB]. The article in Greek seems to be [according to  
> Wallace'=
> s intro] a most curious thing. Its uses are not immediately apparent  
> to the=
> novice and does not function in the same as e.g. English. We see  
> articles =
> appearing and disappearing seemingly arbitrarily.
> Wallace mentions Middleton's book The Doctrine of the Article [150+  
> yrs old=
> now apparently].
>
> I'd be interested to know the current state of knowledge=2C any  
> comments on=
> the treatment of the subject in GGBB -- and also=2C something that  
> occurre=
> d to me in the discussion on Zechariah -- namely=2C if the Biblical  
> writers=
> are introducing Hebraisms [and Aramaisms] into their [Greek]  
> texts=2C does=
> this not present a problem in trying to arrive at a definition of  
> "correct=
> " Greek usage? Does this force us to look outside of the Biblical  
> texts for=
> correct usage since the LXX is [mostly] from Hebrew and chunks of  
> the NT a=
> re [apparently] reporting on proceedings conducted in Aramaic [or is  
> the la=
> tter true only of the gospels?] Or put another way=2C where do we  
> look in t=
> he Bible for examples of good Greek?
>
> Just curious. Hope this makes sense!
> Rgds
> Stephen Baldwin
> stbaldwi at hotmail.com
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------
>> From: albert.pietersma at sympatico.ca
>> To: cwconrad2 at mac.com
>> Date: Tue=2C 13 Oct 2009 10:13:30 -0400
>> CC: leonardj at live.com=3B b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
>> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Zechariah 8:3 (LXX)
>>
>> The presence or absence of articles in most the LXX is certainly one
>> of its biggest problems. Carl is quite right in suggesting that in
>> Zech 8:3 (and often in the LXX) one cannot rely on the translated  
>> text
>> to reflect standard usage. While it can be safely stated that  
>> articles
>> in the Hebrew text are typically represented in the Greek=2C it can  
>> not
>> be inferred that articles in the Greek have explicit warrant in the
>> Hebrew parent text. Ergo: usage in the LXX is not bona fide Greek
>> usage until proven to be such.
>> Al
>> On Oct 13=2C 2009=2C at 5:51 AM=2C Carl Conrad wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 13=2C 2009=2C at 2:27 AM=2C Leonard Jayawardena wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> KLHQHSETAI hH IEROUSALHM POLIS hH ALHQINH KAI TO OROS KURIOU
>>>> PANTOKRATOROS OROS hAGION.
>>>>
>>>> POLIS hH ALHQINH is translated "a true city" in Brenton's
>>>> translation and "a city that is true" in the NETS translation.
>>>>
>>>> What purpose does the definite article serve before ALHQINH? Why
>>>> isn't in the form POLIS ALHQINH in parallel with OROS hAGION?
>>>> Alternatively=2C why not OROS TO hAGION in parallel with POLIS hH
>>>> ALHQINH?
>>>>
>>>> POLIS hH ALHQINH is literally "a city=2C the true one"?
>>>
>>> I think what we have here in the Greek LXX text is simply a literal
>>> translation of the Hebrew construct-noun IR-hA-EMETH=2C in which  
>>> case
>>> the Greek definite article isn't functioning as it ordinarily does  
>>> in
>>> Greek usage.
>>>
>>>
>>> Carl W. Conrad
>>> Department of Classics=2C Washington University (Retired)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
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>>> B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
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>>>
>>
>> =97
>> Albert Pietersma PhD
>> 21 Cross Street=2C
>> Weston ON Canada M9N 2B8
>> Email: albert.pietersma at sympatico.ca
>> Homepage: http://www.chass.utoronto.ca/~pietersm
>>
>> ---
>> B-Greek home page: http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek
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—
Albert Pietersma PhD
21 Cross Street,
Weston ON Canada M9N 2B8
Email: albert.pietersma at sympatico.ca
Homepage: http://www.chass.utoronto.ca/~pietersm




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