[B-Greek] 1 John 1.9 Ed Glasscock in latest BibSac

Mitch Larramore mitchlarramore at yahoo.com
Wed May 6 05:50:12 EDT 2009


Rod:

I want to put in front of us my first question that is deemed "forbidden." It read as follows:

Does the Present Tense verb (hOMOLOGEW)
really refer to some ongoing process? Does a
Present Tense verb direct the readers'
attention to the future, ever? I'm not sure I
see how a Present Tense verb speaks to any
issues beyond the "present."

My concern is whether or not a Present Tense ever refers to the FUTURE. This was what Ed Glasscock says in the BibSac article. My question is about the temporal nature of a Present Tense verb(al) and whether or not a Present Tense FORM has the capacity to include more than the 'present time.' My hope was to move the discussion to its Grammatical Aspect (the form of a verbal) and its temporal aspect.

I think if the Present Tense, by its "in progress" aspect, refers to some 'ongoing process (off into the future),' then we will need to say this about all Present Tense verbals. Wouldn't that alone create havoc as we translate the GNT. But, if we limit any Present Tense verb to a temporal "currently in progress," then we can limit its temporal aspect to the present time. I think the Future Tense verbs are used if the author wants to make a comment about the future. I just don't see how we can allow a Present Tense verb to have any reference to the future. This is what I'm trying to get feedback on.

Mitch Larramore
Sugar Land, Texas


--- On Tue, 5/5/09, Rod Rogers <rngrogers at embarqmail.com> wrote:

> From: Rod Rogers <rngrogers at embarqmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] 1 John 1.9 Ed Glasscock in latest BibSac
> To: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 9:45 PM
> Mitch, in your first question you are
> asking
> a forbidden question on this list. Maybe that
> is why no one has addressed your question.
> You asked, "Does the Present Tense verb
> (hOMOLOGEW) really refer to some ongoing
> process?", What you are really asking,
> couched in a grammatical question is, "Do I
> need to continually ask for forgiveness for
> my sins as a believer?", "Does hOMOLOGEW mean
> continuously confess?". Grammar alone is in
> sufficient to answer your question, I
> believe. Context determines how hOMOLOGEW is
> understood in this verse. I would suggest you
> determine if this is a "PRE" or "POST"
> salvation confession and if this verse is
> directed toward the believer or unbeliever.
> Until you determine what context 1 John 1:9
> falls in you will be hopelessly guessing at
> it's meaning.
> 
> As to your second question, "Is that the
> function of the Aorist Tense (in any mood) to
> indicate 'actuality'?", I believe the answer
> is no. I believe that the subjunctive mood is
> used here to establish the potential of the
> forgiveness of sins. That potential is only
> met when one confesses his sins. The $64.00
> question is, "When does this happen"? I'll
> leave that up to you.
> 
> rod rogers
> Bargersville, In
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Mitch Larramore
> To: B Greek
> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 2:11 AM
> Subject: [B-Greek] 1 John 1.9 Ed Glasscock in
> latest BibSac
> 
> 
> 
> Ed Glasscock, an unknown to me, has an
> article in BibSac on 1 John 1.9 and I wanted
> to ask a question or two on comments he
> makes.
> 
> "The present tense verb "confess" implies a
> continual process of confessing, which
> indicates the continual potential of sin in a
> believer's life."
> 
> Does the Present Tense verb (hOMOLOGEW)
> really refer to some ongoing process? Does a
> Present Tense verb direct the readers'
> attention to the future, ever? I'm not sure I
> see how a Present Tense verb speaks to any
> issues beyond the "present."
> 
> "The verb AFHi is an aorist subjunctive
> verb..." [In a footnote he adds, "The aorist
> simply asserts the actuality of the
> event..."]
> 
> Is that the function of the Aorist Tense (in
> any mood) to indicate 'actuality'? I can see
> an Indicative Mood denoting 'actuality,' but
> not an Aorist verb, or a Subjunctive Mood
> verbal, ever.
> 
> Mitch Larramore
> Sugar Land, Texas
> 
> 
> 
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