[B-Greek] 1 John 1.9 Ed Glasscock in latest BibSac

Carl Conrad cwconrad2 at mac.com
Tue May 5 09:25:05 EDT 2009


On May 5, 2009, at 9:01 AM, George F Somsel wrote:

> While it is true that the pres ind can indicate an ongoing process,  
> I don't see that one can say that it would imply a continual  
> process.  Take for example Mk 2.16
>
> 6καὶ οἱ γραμματεῖς τῶν Φαρισαίων  
> ἰδόντες ὅτι ἐσθίειμετὰ τῶν  
> ἁμαρτωλῶν καὶ τελωνῶν ἔλεγον τοῖς  
> μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ·ὅτι μετὰ τῶν  
> τελωνῶν καὶ ἁμαρτωλῶν ἐσθίει;
> 6 KAI hOI GRAMMATEIS TWN FARISAIWN IDONTES hOTI ESQIEI META TWN  
> hAMARTWLWN KAI TELWNWN ELEGON TOIS MAQHTAIS AUTOU, hOTI META TWN  
> TELWNWN KAI hAMARTWLWN ESQIEI?
>
> Are we to here understand that the scribes are asking whether Jesus  
> ALWAYS CONTINUES to eat with "tax collectors and sinners"?  Do we  
> not have accounts of Jesus eating with the scribes themselves? I get  
> a bit concerned when I hear pronouncements that a particular tense  
> is used in X manner as though it is always and only used in that  
> manner.  I think we need to attempt to establish how a tense in used  
> in each instance (which might differ from one passage to another).   
> I don't recommend a "Theology of the Tenses."  What we have in Mk  
> 2.16 is not a question regarding an ongoing or continual act but  
> rather a question regarding an iterative or customary act -- "Is he  
> in the habit of eating … ?"

I would understand ESQIEI here in the sense of habitual practice: "He  
eats (regularly, quite commonly) with tax-collectors and sinners."

But I would agree with George on the issue attempting to develop a  
"theology of tenses." The imperfective in this instance too could  
certainly be understood in terms of recurrent acts of confession  
rather than something like "uninterrupted confession."

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)

> From: Mitch Larramore <mitchlarramore at yahoo.com>
> To: B Greek <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Sent: Monday, May 4, 2009 11:11:36 PM
> Subject: [B-Greek] 1 John 1.9 Ed Glasscock in latest BibSac
>
>
> Ed Glasscock, an unknown to me, has an article in BibSac on 1 John  
> 1.9 and I wanted to ask a question or two on comments he makes.
>
> "The present tense verb "confess" implies a continual process of  
> confessing, which indicates the continual potential of sin in a  
> believer's life."
>
> Does the Present Tense verb (hOMOLOGEW) really refer to some ongoing  
> process? Does a Present Tense verb direct the readers' attention to  
> the future, ever? I'm not sure I see how a Present Tense verb speaks  
> to any issues beyond the "present."
>
> "The verb AFHi is an aorist subjunctive verb..." [In a footnote he  
> adds, "The aorist simply asserts the actuality of the event..."]
>
> Is that the function of the Aorist Tense (in any mood) to indicate  
> 'actuality'? I can see an Indicative Mood denoting 'actuality,' but  
> not an Aorist verb, or a Subjunctive Mood verbal, ever.
>
> Mitch Larramore






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