[B-Greek] Acts 10:48 (Was B-Greek Question)

Carl W. Conrad cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
Fri Apr 21 14:45:28 EDT 2006


On Apr 21, 2006, at 2:31 PM, Webb wrote:

>
> Let's not forget that, in the mouths of the gospel writers, John  
> was capable
> of saying, "I baptized you". Paul also talks about having baptized  
> some
> people. So the physical process (does someone lay hands on the  
> person being
> baptized, lead them to the water, stand in the water with them,  
> dunk them,
> etc.) is not necessarily what is determinative of the meaning of  
> the verb
> here. The question is, in the terminology of the writer of Acts, is  
> one
> baptized by others, or does one baptize oneself? I think the former  
> can be
> asserted with confidence.

Why with confidence? What do we know of actual practice -- AT THE  
TIME OF JESUS AND PAUL? Is there NT evidence for what -- precisely --  
the BAPTIZWN physically did to the BAPTIZOMENOS? This question has  
nothing to do with early  or later) ecclesiastical practice. I think  
we tend to approach this question with a load of assumptions that  
haven't been validated.

> I think the writer intends to convey that Peter ordered Jewish  
> Christians
> standing there to baptize those who had received the message.
> Webb Mealy
>
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org]
>> On Behalf Of Carl W. Conrad
>> Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 11:17 AM
>> To: Harold Holmyard
>> Cc: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
>> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Acts 10:48 (Was B-Greek Question)
>>
>>
>> On Apr 21, 2006, at 1:44 PM, Harold Holmyard wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Randall,
>>>
>>>> Culturally, the person "baptising someone else" is functioning as a
>>>> witness and a teacher. Contrary to endless debates, they did not  
>>>> dunk
>>>> or pour (or sprinkle). The person being baptised went down with  
>>>> their
>>>> own motor skills while the teacher was a witness. Now many  
>>>> people on
>>>> the list will read Acts 8:35ff as putting Phillip in the water
>>>> itself,
>>>> but that is not a necessary reading if one starts with the cultural
>>>> pictures just described. As for the Greek here, the PAQHTIKH
>>>> experiencer/passive would be naturally read as MESH middle.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> HH: Do I assume correctly that this implies an idea like: "And he
>>> ordered them to get baptized . . . "?
>>
>> Better: "get themselves baptized" (text: PROSETAXEN DE AUTOUS EN TWi
>> ONOMATI IHSOU CRISTOU BAPTISQHNAI), understanding BAPTISQHNAI in an
>> aorist MIDDLE sense. That is, as Randall explained it, they were to
>> perform the acts for themselves.
>>
>> Carl W. Conrad
>> Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
>> 1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
>> cwconrad2 at mac.com
>> WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/
>>
>> ---
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>
>
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Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad2 at mac.com
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/




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