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cc-jo - Re: [CC-Jordan] Creative Commons Corporation منظمة المشاع الابداعي

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Subject: CC Jordan

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  • From: Rami Olwan <ramiolwan AT yahoo.com>
  • To: Stephanie Raye Safi <stephanie.safi AT nklc.ae>
  • Cc: cc-jo AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [CC-Jordan] Creative Commons Corporation منظمة المشاع الابداعي
  • Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 21:31:34 -0800 (PST)

Hi Stephanie Safi,

 

Thank you for your comments. Although your comments are merely linguistic, and I was hoping to some kind of legal input; I still think they are useful at least to take the discussion further. This is an important factor in launching a successful CC Jordan project. I hereby reply to your comments as follows: 

 

1) The translation of Commons to “mashaa”

 

This has been a controversial matter from the beginning. Most of the comments that we have received so far are not happy with the translation and there were several suggestions. They are mainly two for the translation of the word “Commons” to Arabic. One suggestion is to use the word “omameyat” and the other is to use the word “mashaa”. The first is not a legal word one and means stuff that is general. The second one “mashaa” is a legal word that is used frequently in legal writings especially property law. It refers in property law to the land that is owned by different people who are not sure what exactly each one owns. I have explained in an earlier post why we have used the term “mashaa”instead of “omameyat” from a legal standing, please read my post for further explanation here http://www.mail-archive.com/cc jo AT lists.ibiblio.org/msg00006.html.

 

As for your suggestion to use the word “moushtarak” instead of “mashaa”, I am not sure if using it will result in proper legal translation of the word (although the Arabic translation might be correct).

 

Also, it will not give the needed meaning of what CC is trying to achieve a bundle of materials over the Internet that people could share and remix legally. This is the main idea behind CC when it started by professor who saw the need to build a rich public domain that less restrictive by the “permission culture” and copyright laws. CC Arab community has agreed in the workshop we have participated recently in Alexandria, Egypt to use “mashaa”, but we are happy to discuss the matter further.

 

2) The use of “you” in Arabic legal documents

 

Your comment is not totally clear, but what I understand that you want us to constantly use “licensee” instead of “you”. We have tried from the beginning to achieve that and I have explained to CC why we need to replace “you” with “licensee”. The main reason for that is because it does not give the proper legal meaning and the word “you” is never used when drafting Arabic legal documents. If we missed replacing the word ‘you’ with “licensee” in one occasion or another, this is a typo and common sense requires from us to be constant throughout the translation.  We will make sure this happens. Please explain further if this is not the case.

 

3) The translation of “Uniform Resource Locater”

 

I do not think it is a good idea to leave the concept of “URL” as it is in English. This is not useful since users of the license might not be familiar with the techno- terminology, and leaving it will not give the proper meaning of Internet address. This could be easily translated to Arabic.

 

Hope this helps. I am happy to explain any of the above further. Thank you for your interest in CC Jordan!

 

Regards,

 

Rami Olwan



--- On Wed, 2/25/09, Stephanie Raye Safi <stephanie.safi AT nklc.ae> wrote:

From: Stephanie Raye Safi <stephanie.safi AT nklc.ae>
Subject: [CC-Jordan] Creative Commons Corporation منظمة المشاع الابداعي
To: cc-jo AT lists.ibiblio.org
Date: Wednesday, February 25, 2009, 11:37 AM

“Creative Commons Corporation” and “Uniform Resource Identifier” do not have their exact translation and meaning in the Arabic version, therefore, I proposed to keep translation and add the transliteration of the words between brackets.

 

However, concerning the name translation of “Creative Commons” ابداعي مشاع, we do not agree that مشاع is the right word to translate “commons”:

 

In fact, (1) the use of the word is as a noun not as an adjective.

 

(2) The term common in Arabic have a meaning of مشترك while the word مشاع imply commonalty.

 

The problem with using  مشاع is that the word is linked to land and real estate. Whereas the word مشترك is a much more general term in terms of its usage.

 

Furthermore, the word  مشترك is less connected to real estate and property and therefore is less likely to cause confusion among the average Arabic user/reader.

 

(3)Finally as we are about to introduce a new legal concept to the Arab market it is advisable to choose as much possible a neutral term such as مشترك.

 

Therefore, we propose to translate “Creative Commons Corporation” as منظمة الابداع المشترك.

 

 

 

Stephanie Safi,

Associate

 

Khasawneh & Associates

Legal Consultants

PO Box 74980, Al Moosa Tower 1,

Sheikh Zayed Road

Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Telephone:  +971 (0) 4332 6550
Mobile:        +971 (0) 556802689

Fax:              +971 (0) 4332 6433

Website        www.nklc.ae

Email:           stephanie.safi AT nklc.ae

 

 

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Amman/Baghdad/Dubai

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