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Subject: Creative Commons - Belgium

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  • From: "wim schreurs" <wim.schreurs AT vub.ac.be>
  • To: <cc-be AT lists.ibiblio.org>
  • Subject: [Cc-be] RE: Cc-be Digest, Vol 7, Issue 6
  • Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 11:53:09 +0200

Hello,

I just gave the Brein letter as an example of what they do and to show how
intimidating they are, e.g. not really stating that only uploading is
illegal and also privately forcing people to sign a letter in which they
must declare to pay Euros to them for each time they do copyright
infringements again ( willingly???).

I am very well aware of the privacy and data protection rules, but these
privacy rules are at the end just some procedural rules that in fact don't
protect privacy and anonymity at all. The music industry files a complaint,
the judge signs, the names of the users are given to the music industry,
there is no criminal procedure (de zaak wordt geseponeerd) and the music
industry starts a procedure on civil liability... Come on...

There is no real privacy, there is just a default procedure to make it
legal.

There is a legal proposal (draft) in a US state where the user at least has
the right to anonymously defend himself against the transmission of his name
by the ISp provider to a third party.

Wim Schreurs
____________________
Wim Schreurs
Faculty of Law
Vrije Universiteit Brussel
Pleinlaan 2, 1050 Elsene
tel : +32.(0)2.629.13.98
fax: +32.(0)2.629.26.62
http://www.vub.ac.be/RG (law faculty)
http://www.vub.ac.be/LSTS (research)



-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
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Onderwerp: Cc-be Digest, Vol 7, Issue 6


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Today's Topics:

1. Re: RE: Cc-be Digest, Vol 6, Issue 7 (Wouter Vanden hove)
2. Re: p2p & film (Wouter Vanden hove)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 01:29:20 +0200
From: Wouter Vanden hove <wouter.vanden.hove AT telenet.be>
Subject: Re: [Cc-be] RE: Cc-be Digest, Vol 6, Issue 7
To: cc-be AT lists.ibiblio.org
Message-ID: <427FF250.3090109 AT telenet.be>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

BeMol!- Marcel Vander Mierde wrote:

> Wim,
> in Belgium, this kind of actions is totally forbidden.
> According to Telecom and privacy-Law a provider may only give
> information about its clients to the court when properly summoned to
> do so.

Not only in Belgium, but also in the Netherlands.
XS4all has very clear statements about this.

See following articles:

Buma/Stemra hekelt providers
http://www.webwereld.nl/articles/31160

Buma/Stemra: Xs4all hypocriet; Wanadoo weigert verzoeken
http://www.tweakers.net/nieuws/36931

The law says:
providers are obliged to follow privacy laws and cannot give out
personal details of its customers to whomever asks for it.
secondly, clients of providers are forbidden to break copyright law.

XS4All adheres to both laws:
it refuses to give out user-details to the music-industry,
and clearly mentions that users are not allowed to break the law.

Buma/Stemra doesn't go after clients of XS4All ... because they cannot
find any that breaks copyright law in the first place.

... Therefore XS4ALL is a hypocrite.

Welcome to the twisted logic of the music industry!


Q&A about the letter BREIN sends can be found the newsletter of BITS OF
FREEDOM: http://www.bof.nl/nieuwsbrief/nieuwsbrief_2005_6.html


This article is also very interesting:
Nederlandse ISP's snel te intimideren
Tekst Multatuli klakkeloos verwijderd
http://zdnet.be/news.cfm?id=40067

Censoring The Net With A Hotmail Account
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/10/09/1929259&tid=153&tid=17

(the same test could be performed with Belgian ISPS.)




Wouter Vanden Hove
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 02:24:14 +0200
From: Wouter Vanden hove <wouter.vanden.hove AT telenet.be>
Subject: Re: [Cc-be] p2p & film
To: "bruno AT indymedia.be" <bruno AT indymedia.be>, cc-be AT lists.ibiblio.org
Message-ID: <427FFF2E.4020301 AT telenet.be>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

bruno AT indymedia.be wrote:
> hello list,
>
> I'm working on an article about the effects of downloading films (be it
> 'legal' or 'illegal' copies) on the movie business, ticket sales, income
> of film makers. I would like to compare the view points and arguments of
> ABDF and the like (www.houdedief.be) with that of theatre owners, film
> makers, journalists, copyright/left scholars & activists.



> some questions to ask: is there a problem, yes or no,
I don't see any problem.

Movie-lovers can download some movies, but nearly all ISP have
download-caps. Most people can only download 10GB/month. I believe the
overall effect to be neglegible.

And what is the difference of creating a movie-collection with your
computer, compated to creating one with your VCR of movies that have
been broadcasted on TV?


why & what's
> people's solutions if there is one?


what do figures say?
Figures coming from **independent** sources don't even find a problem in
downloading music, let alone movies.
Take a look at:
The Effect of File Sharing on Record Sales An Empirical Analysis
http://www.unc.edu/~cigar/papers/FileSharing_March2004.pdf




what about the
> role of the dvd sales?

DVDs are the future.

No sane individual is going to invest large amounts of money anymore
in creating a personal music-library based on CD's.
That is the real reason why the sales of CD's drop.
Buying CD's is quickly becoming the same as buying LP's.


> I would like to ask you people if you have any suggestions for this
> article.

1) You should mention the case of Jon Johansen, who legally bought a
DVD, and unsuccesfully tried to play it in his GNU/Linux-computer.
Then he wrote some software himself and some others,
And guess what? The movie-industry sued him.
Eventually, he won the case.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Johansen


2) You should look at the history, and the things that were predicted in
the past by the film/music-industry.

"the VCR is to the American film producer and the American public as the
Boston strangler is to the woman home alone." -- Jack Valenti, President
MPAA.

While nowadays rentals of videocassette account for roughly 60% of
Hollywood's income.

For a brief overview of the BETAMAX-case, see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Corp._v._Universal_City_Studios
this is the case where the movie-industry tried to outlaw the
video-recorder.


3) The recent controverse (and victory) surrounding the "Broadcast Flag"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast_flag
http://www.eff.org/broadcastflag/
http://www.publicknowledge.org/issues/bfcase




> are there people you think I should talk to? studies I should
> look at? other interesting info? do you know about previous articles
> about this?

have a look at the box-office records:
http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/records/
Do you see any signs of a crisis in the movie-industry?


Here are some sources on the Copyright-debate :
http://www.opencursus.org/archief/copyright/

I'll recommend:
Free Culture - Larry Lessig.pdf


some organisations:
http://www.eff.org/
http://www.freeculture.org/
http://www.publicknowledge.org



Wouter Vanden Hove
opencursus.org
skepp.be
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End of Cc-be Digest, Vol 7, Issue 6
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  • [Cc-be] RE: Cc-be Digest, Vol 7, Issue 6, wim schreurs, 05/20/2005

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