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b-hebrew - Re: [b-hebrew] Genesis 31: 47: What Foreign Language Is That?

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  • From: Isaac Fried <if AT math.bu.edu>
  • To: george.athas AT moore.edu.au
  • Cc: b-hebrew AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Genesis 31: 47: What Foreign Language Is That?
  • Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 22:36:12 -0500

George,

I am really, really sorry that you were offended by my choice of words. I surely had no intention, be it the slightest, of caricaturing your statement, except of recasting it into my own words for the sake of my own apprehension.
For the record, I don't dispute the function of -UT. Our disagreement is on its meaning. It is still my understanding that you are saying - UT is inherently meaningless [except for it being an abstract grammatical marker], while I contend it is a personal pronoun, or a string thereof.
I would be greatly reluctant to comment on the formation of English words, but it superficially appears to me that the suffix -ism is the compound [via Latin etc., etc.] of the substantives is-am or is-in. I am not sure what is the meaning of the suffix -tion, but in any event, the consensus is that it is meaningless as a stand-alone.
I am also surprised and saddened by your qualification of my sincere effort, be it extra consensual, to explain my ideas about the Hebrew language as "condescending rhetoric".

Isaac Fried, Boston University

On Nov 25, 2007, at 6:04 PM, George Athas wrote:

No, Isaac, the particle -UT is not a 'random syllable' - no one has
ever said it was. Nor am I saying that it is a 'heedless hoot'. Your
caricature of my statement is most unscholarly, and I'm reticent to
respond to it. Nonetheless, I'll accord you the dignity of a response,
despite your condescending rhetoric.

The particle -UT is an abstract noun marker, much the same way the
particle -tion is in English. For example, if you take the words
'corrupt', 'operate' or 'animate' and add the particle -tion to them,
you end up with some abstract nouns: corruption, operation, and
animation. There are even words in which the particle -tion is an
integral and irremovable part, such as 'nation' or 'salvation'. Or,
to take another example, the particle -ism can be added to words
yielding such abstract nouns as tourism, communism, and
fundamentalism.

The particle -UT works in a very similar way to these in Hebrew and
Aramaic.

I expect you'll disagree with this, but please do so with some
respect, also acknowledging that this is what the scholarly consensus
is.



GEORGE ATHAS
Moore Theological College (Sydney)
1 King St, Newtown, NSW 2042, Australia
Ph: (+61 2) 9577 9774





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