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  • From: Kitty Cunningham <klparmley AT gmail.com>
  • To: "Randall Austin" <ra41717 AT gmail.com>, "Blair Christian" <blair.christian AT gmail.com>
  • Cc: ocba AT lists.ibiblio.org
  • Subject: Re: [ocba] Fall nectar flow estimates? Fall maintenance?
  • Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 21:41:54 -0400

Does this mean pollen supplements really aren't needed for us this winter (with 2 brand new hives this year)? I have needed to give some syrup while still seeing pollen coming in this month. So far, everything going as expected. Now, we're waiting to see how the Fall flow plays out.

We're expecting to learn to make fondant this Fall. But if I don't need to shop for pollen powder, that would be great.

I would have asked on Thursday, but work was a bear when I got back from the beach and I couldn't get there.

Kitty

-----Original Message----- From: Randall Austin
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2012 7:55 PM
To: Blair Christian
Cc: ocba AT lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: Re: [ocba] Fall nectar flow estimates? Fall maintenance?

Hey Blair,

I'm sure things vary across the Triangle, but at my house in the
northeastern corner of rural Orange County:
1) pollen never seems to be a problem, at least not for extended periods
of time. If the bees can fly they can get pollen from something around here.
2) typically the nectar flow is tremendous April to June, nonexistent
July through August, and quite sufficient to make winter stores
September through October. It stops at the first hard frost. Note that I
said "typically" --- this year is definitely not typical. If the fall
flow starts early, maybe it will be extra good this year?
3) my bees don't draw comb on the fall flow. The fall flow doesn't put
them in "expansion mode".
4) in a normal year with a normal hive, my bees can easily and
predictably fill a deep for winter stores during the fall flow, no
problem. Maybe two-thirds of years are normal and two-thirds of my hives
are normal. Feeding fills the gaps. The fall flow is goldenrod and
asters. Goldenrod is already blooming but will pick up more later. The
asters start blooming sometime in September. That's when the bees really
start packing it in. You'll know it when the asters get going -- curing
aster honey has a very strong sour stink that you can smell from a
distance of thirty feet or more from your hives. That's a great smell,
since it means your bees are well provisioned for winter!
5) Scrawny hives in fall will be dead hives by next spring, or at best
poor performers, whether they've got food or not. I'm not very good at
biting the bullet and combining weak hives with strong ones --- I
usually want to "give them a little longer" and that never works out --- but I'm slowing learning from experience and becoming more practical.
Fall is a great time to sort the winners from the losers because you can
consolidate stores from a decent hive and a weak hive to make one
well-provisioned hive with a good chance of survival. Hives are usually
weak for a reason (lousy queen, etc.), not just from a lack of
population, so combining 2 weak hives usually gives you a big weak hive.

Anybody have other perspectives?

Randall Austin


On 8/9/2012 9:46 AM, Blair Christian wrote:
Hi All,

I was feeding last fall and didn't really notice what the fall flow
was like. Is there somebody with experience who can tell us what the
fall flows can be like around here?

- Is there always sufficient pollen (looks like that's never a problem)

- What is the variation (time of year, volume) of the nectar flows?

- Is it enough of a fall flow for them to draw comb? (usually?)

- Is it enough for a strong double deep hive to fill a deep with
capped honey between now and November? Or should I plan on feeding?

- When is the time to "take our winter losses" around here?

I went through about a dozen of this year's hives last night pretty
fast. They are all queenright, but have varying amounts of undrawn
frames/stored honey. Most of them have moved the brood nest down into
the bottom deeps (In June, most were in the top deep). They all seem
to have plenty of pollen. I'll probably do my fall varroa
check/treatment in September. Other than that, all I foresee until
spring is feeding as necessary and occasional checks. Most of my
hives have had entrance reducers on since the summer dearth, and I
guess I'll keep them on unless the flow really picks up. And if
anybody wants a good method for working with sugar syrup in 5 gallon
batches, here's my advice:
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/bnTDpiU3o3XZ8U7rvhU319MTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
The modified Cauble method, if you will. Fill up a 5 gallon bucket
half way with warm water, take it outside, throw in the sugar and a
sump pump, and run it for 10-20 min. Cover any extra with a cheap
lid, and it will keep for a while. You can leave the bucket for the
bees to clean up, so there's not much clean up, no inside mess, etc.

Best,
Blair
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