To: permaculture <permaculture@lists.ibiblio.org>, pt-diploma <pt-diploma@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [permaculture] Forced Organ Harvesting in China - Colheita forçada de órgãos na China
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2016 10:17:47 +0100
This second email on this topic could only happen because a previous email
got the feedback below inviting to somehow expand the understanding of
permaculture and its use on a very difficult need.
Further, on the topic:
Last June "Hearing in EU Parliament on Update on Organ
Pillaging/Trafficking in China
If you care to read and present your questions and from all this feedback
proccess some learning (understanding of permaculture and the permaculture
"alternative nation" - Bill Mollison's term, what is and is not) and
individual and collective action might take place.
Possibly with tears in your eyes, we act with the most respect to the
victims of genocide today and everywhere, not just indifference or just a
horrible feeling and go on with my "permaculture day" as usual.
Disturbing question:
What if the "permaculture nation" in China or USA, or anywhere, was being
murdered, would the toppic fit here?
If permaculture does not already, as some of you point out, permaculture
must include "alternative nation strategies" to deal with such news, needs
of our fellow permaculture nation, aware of this, present in China for
instance.
Toby's reply (email below) "Forwarding “news” and a petition about yet
another example of human cruelty, of the thousands that we are all aware
of, does not add to our grasp of permaculture. What possible excuse is
there to forward this here? It teaches us nothing about “the genocide
sector” that we don’t know. It has nothing to do with permaculture."
And we do not know about: "permaculture nation answer to the genocide
sector" ...
Of course, all the feed back this as received so far here teaches us
something
about our individual and collective understanding of permaculture present
in this list.
Do we accept the question "How does our "permaculture nation" (Bill's
sense) will react to news reporting genocide and proccesses addressing the
issue?"
It is surprising to see that one possible reaction / feedback to awful news
is: "We (this list - alternative nation) just block the news - block any
learning proccess". Then do we accept this question: "But, how does the
permaculture people/nation living in China will react to such feedback
coming from
permaculture nation living in USA and Europe?"
Such news need collective thoughtful observation and action and must not
receive "the blocking" feedback from the permaculture collective.
This needs thoughtful obervation: "The permaculture collective
responsability is different from the permaculture individual
responsability." / What we must do is different from what I must do.
Should we deny "our responsability"?
Understanding of permaculture and ecological principles is taking place
everywhere and the topic
of how "we as alternative nation" are going to integrate difficult
questions is here now.
The "I know better than you" type individuals feedback does not help, but
"Could you make the connection to Permaculture, the topic of this list
please?" opens the gates of heaven.
... so we could shift a bit towards
how do we as permaculture groups and the collective builds a observation
proccess and action that connects us in a synergistic
way with people outside the "alternative nation" working towards the same
goal.
Taking Toby's
"Back to solving problems we might actually solve, at a scale we can work,
with the people working on the same issues globally."
Let us take our permaculture understanding to help where there is a need.
And NOT say:
"there is a genocide and crimes against humanity (not near us) but
permaculture understanding and I and we can not and must not do nothing
about it because permaculture says we can not do nothing about it, that we
as a collective must block this type of news to our collective
conversations".
We/Permaculture is here to serve all humanity, and must take into account
all our needs - permaculture people living in China too - and they must not
go alone with this.
We go on working towards a collective thoughtful observation not only "my
thoughtful observation"? Hopefully mostly outside this list.
This goes too to the portuguese permaculture group/list working on "local
diploma proccess".
Thank you for your feedback so far.
Now, time to take the goats out and flood irrigate the garden, they are
waiting longer than usual.
Best regards,
João
On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 3:31 AM, Toby Hemenway <toby@patternliteracy.com>
wrote: