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[EarthNSky <erthnsky AT bellsouth.net>]

Marie McHarry wrote:

> He's no angel -- Bagram Air Force base and unnamed black sites still 
> hold prisoners. So far as I can tell, torture is still going on to 
> some extent. However, he seems to be backing away from torture.

Actually, I had just the opposite impression, maybe because I associate
those camps with torture and the camps are still open.  Seems to me he
ran strongly opposed to such, on the moral high ground, and has  now
'backslid' to a position of tolerance.

> I don't know how the rest of you all feel, but I truly believe that 
> torture is not only illegal but also immoral and that it hurts the 
> torturer at least as much as it does the victims of torture. Abu
> Graib resulted in the death of many Americans. Obama has at least
> stopped that, but I fear he hasn't gone far enough.

You know, I am not sure how I feel about torture, whether it is ever
necessary or useful in any situation.  I would agree with your statement
above, but maybe not exclusively. Perhaps we can talk about torture on
the list without bashing any administration.  It certainly is something
what has been widespread throughout human history.

I don't think torture is as used as much as our media would allow us to
believe.  Remember back in 1991 when the Iraqi's were surrendering en
masse?  They surrendered and later extolled the graces of the US
military, how civilized we were, no torture, good care, etc.  We have
become so politically correct that people think a jail cell without a
computer and television is torture and cruelty.  Personally, while
denying someone a Book of Faith is not nice, probably immoral, I don't
think that qualifies as torture.  Sleep deprivation, I don't know.
Waterboarding, yeah, I think it is.
Everyone should realize, too, that we use these techniques on our own
troops as resistance training.  In a similar fashion, almost all police
cadets are shot with bean bags and/or pepper spray.

B


--
Sleep well tonight, for somewhere in the ocean's depths, MY son is
protecting your freedom on the USS Key West, currently deployed
somewhere in the Pacific and/or Indian Ocean.  Go Navy!
EarthNSky Farm, NW Georgia, USA