[b-hebrew] Daniel

Yigal Levin leviny1 at mail.biu.ac.il
Sun Sep 3 05:05:59 EDT 2006


I'll try to answer this one:

1. There is a difference between a prophet's "hearing" God directly, which 
is "real" prophecy, and a person's having dreams and visions, which he 
(correctly) understands as God's revealing various "secrets". Daniel's 
visions are of the latter type. So the rabbis, by not counting Daniel as a 
"full-fledged" prophet, do not really contradict scripture.

2. It is not quite true that the Sanhedrin did not operate in Babylonia, 
according to the rabbinic re-construction of history, Mordechai was the head 
of the "sanhedrin" in his generation, even though he lived in Persia. The 
sanhedrin was re-established in the land of Israel by Ezra, under the title 
of "the Great Assembly".

Yigal Levin
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bryant J. Williams III" <bjwvmw at com-pair.net>
To: "b-hebrew" <b-hebrew at lists.ibiblio.org>; "Shoshanna Walker" 
<rosewalk at concentric.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 9:26 AM
Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Daniel


> Dear Shoshanna,
>
> I am sure that what you have said regarding Daniel not receiving visions
> directly from God would be incorrect since it clearly says in Daniel
> 2:19-23,
>
>    19 - "Then was the secret revealed unto Daniel in a night vision. Then
> Daniel blessed the God of heaven. Daniel answered and said, Blessed be the
> name of God for ever and ever: for wisdom and might are his: and he 
> changeth
> the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he
> giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know 
> understanding:
> he revealeth the deep and secret things: he knoweth what is in the 
> darkness,
> and light dwelleth with him. I thank thee, and praise thee, O thou God of 
> my
> fathers, who hast given me wisdom and might, and hast made known unto me 
> now
> what we desired of thee: for thou hast now made known unto us the king's
> matter."
>
> Thus, Daniel himself says that he received the vision from God. The other
> visions that Daniel received had the interpretation given by an angel to
> God.
>
> Now, do I accept what Scripture says or do I follow what the rabbi's have
> said? Obviously, the Sanhedrin was not in operation in Babylon.
>
> Rev. Bryant J. Williams III
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Shoshanna Walker" <rosewalk at concentric.net>
> To: "b-hebrew" <b-hebrew at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Sent: Saturday, September 02, 2006 10:24 PM
> Subject: Re: [b-hebrew] Daniel
>
>
> It don't think he was "demoted", because he's in Vilna Gaon's list of
> the 48 male prophets of Israel (prophet number 44) - and apparently
> there was some disagreement.
>
> Rashi doesn't include him in his list, and I posted where the Talmud
> says he was not a prophet.
>
> I think that the best,  most common sense  and non-religious reason
> why he would not be considered a prophet, is because he didn't
> receive his visions directly from G-d.
>
> Very simple.  Whether he was rejected by Sanhedrin, or even APPLIED
> to Sanhedrin, I don't know - the literature is too vast for me to
> figure out where to look it up.
>
> But now I'm very curious.
>
> Shoshanna
>
>
>
>
> As for why Daniel was/is not considered a prophet, there are more than
> one reasons given, the most important I heard was because he was a
> court official in an enslaving kingdom. Peterö's suggestion that he
> was "demoted" as a reaction to Christian citing of his prophecies
> probably also played a part.
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