Hosea 12:4

Theodore H. Mann theomann at earthlink.net
Wed Dec 26 12:17:26 EST 2001

I very much appreciate your response to my question.
I hope you'll be patient with someone (me) who knows nothing about Hebrew,
but if the Hebrew clearly says "us," why would translators render it as
"him" on the basis of exegetical considerations or Freudian theory?  To an
untutored person like myself, it sounds as though it is being said that a
mistake was made by Hosea; that is, that he wrote "us," but probably meant

Many thanks.


> It should probably be translated "him."
> The Hebrew has "us" as Shoshana notes,
> but the sense of the passage (referring to Jacob)
> suggests "him" and so the versions have translated it.
> On the other hand, it is possible that a double-entendre
> is meant here, or a Freudian slip by the author.
> Jacob stands really for the whole Northern Kingdom,
> and Hosea chastises them throughout for worship at
> Beth-El (House of God), which he calls Beth-Aven (House of Iniquity).
> (Tho see an interesting article by N.Na'aman on that.)
> It could be that the author is now saying that the angel
> encountered us at Bet-el, and strove with us there, putting
> himself along with the people he is castigating. 
> Hosea doesn't do that elsewhere tho, he never puts himself
> along with the people he blames. So, it probably should be
> emmended to "him" with the versions.
> Liz
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Ted Mann [mailto:theomann at earthlink.net]
> > Sent: Tue, December 25, 2001 11:30 AM
> > To: Biblical Hebrew
> > Subject: Hosea 12:4
> > 
> > 
> > Greetings good friends:
> > 
> > It has been pointed out to me that the last part of Hosea 12:4 is 
> > sometimes
> > translated into English as "And there He spoke with us," and sometimes as
> > "And there He spoke with him."  Why the difference, and which is correct?
> > Many thanks.
> > 
> > Ted
> > Dr. Theodore H. Mann
> > theomann at earthlink.net
> > http://home.earthlink.net/~theomann
> > 
> > 
> > 
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