[permaculture] Any attempt to policing PDC standards without clear policy is open to nepotism

A Sampson-Kelly april at permaculturevisions.com
Wed Jan 1 01:34:13 EST 2014


In answer to one of the issues that arose at the recent Permaculture 
Convergence about validity of PDCs I wish to declare that any attempt to 
policing PDC standards without clear policy leave the movement open only 
to nepotism.
We need make a clear statement upholding the original standard for PDC 
courses
(BTW I refuse to waste my time reflecting on the validity of the 
different delivery methods as such futile debate is not going to change 
the diversity of delivery options worldwide and is certainly not going 
to stop me continuing to do what was declared to be very tricky indeed - 
and yes Mr Pittman I agree online teaching is very tricky)

I have collated the basic topics on the original PDC as written in a 
short guide by the first Permaculture Institute.
In 1993 I purchased this guide and it follows the cirricula in the 
Permaculture Designer's Manual (although I wish to point out that there 
are one or two glaring omissions in the Manual)
so there is no dispute about the autheticity and intent of the topic names.
I am sure that over time people have changed the language to suit their 
culture, time and nature of their delivery of a PDC.
I am merely enabling the original topics to be accessible to all.
here is the link to the PDC standard topic list 
http://permaculturevisions.com/courses/permaculture-design-course/permaculture-design-course-outline/



-- 

*April S-Kelly*
Additional Email: aprilskellymtkembla at gmail.com
Write: Permaculture Visions Cordeaux Rd Mt Kembla Village 2526 Australia
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On 29/12/2013 5:05 AM, permaculture-request at lists.ibiblio.org wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
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>     1. Re: IPC11 Musings II (Roberto Sanchez)
>     2. Re: Future Scenarios (Jono Neiger)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 11:37:05 -0500
> From: "Roberto Sanchez" <roberto.sanchez at fanj.cult.cu>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] IPC11 Musings II
> To: "'permaculture'" <permaculture at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID: <004401cf03eb$0b64ff80$222efe80$@fanj.cult.cu>
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I don?t speaks English, but can read some words.
>
> I want said thanks Scott for your comment about IPC11, are very important
> for us.
>
> Roberto S?nchez
>
>
> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: permaculture-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
> [mailto:permaculture-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] En nombre de Scott Pittman
> Enviado el: viernes, 27 de diciembre de 2013 22:38
> Para: 'permaculture'
> Asunto: Re: [permaculture] IPC11 Musings II
>
> This is my second installment of the IPC 11 musings.
>
> Scott Pittman
>
> "To change something build a new model that makes the existing model
> obsolete"  Buckminster Fuller
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2013 13:05:30 -0500
> From: Jono Neiger <neiger at csld.edu>
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] Future Scenarios
> To: permaculture <permaculture at lists.ibiblio.org>
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAM0CCauBRy01NVKO6YWu_DsF0J0N_VXMS8GwW3TmLZehEQMG_w at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> I agree heartily with what you're saying Toby. As far as a movement, I
> rather see the permaculture scene as a "network".
>
> As a network, we're a huge global collection of individuals and
> organizations working in myriad ways to, as you say, build a more
> sustainable (regenerative) and just world. We don't all agree on approach
> and focus. We can align for specific work, share resource, interconnect to
> support each other. Networks are made of nodes and links. We look to
> leverage the fact that we can't do everything and we must rely on others in
> the network doing their piece.
>
> There;s a substantial amount of work thats been done in building networks.
> I attach here one paper on network building, specifically for social change.
>
> Jono
>
>
> ******************
> Jono Neiger
> Regenerative Design Group
> www.regenerativedesigngroup.com
>
> Conway School
> Graduate Program in Sustainable Landscape Planning & Design
> www.csld.edu
>
> PINE; Permaculture Institute of the Northeast
> www.northeastpermaculture.org
>
> *Workshops This Winter:*
> ? Whole Farm Design, Advanced Permaculture
> Course<http://bigsmallfarm.org/news/whole-farm-design-advanced-permaculture-course-jono-neiger-january-2014/>,
> Big Small Farm, Bushnell Florida, January 2014
> ? Advanced Permaculture and Agroforestry, Maya Mountain Research Farm,
> Belize, March, 2014
> ?
> Local Food Enterprise Summit/Financial Permaculture
> Course<http://www.financialpermaculture.com/courses/2014miami>,
> Miami, March 10-14
> ? Urban Permaculture Design Certificate Course, Tampa
> Bay<http://www.permacultureguild.us/urban-permaculture-design-course-tampa-bay/>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 26, 2013 at 3:41 PM, Toby Hemenway <toby at patternliteracy.com>wrote:
>
>> Thanks for this valuable post, Jason, and for the kind words. You've said
>> something here that I think is crucial:
>>
>>> We have to remember that we're not promoting permaculture for the sake of
>>> permaculture*.* We're promoting permaculture as a way for people to
>>> significantly change their lives. Permaculture is not the goal, shifts in
>>> the way people think and act is the goal.
>> Amen. I think of permaculturists as the design and implementation arm of
>> the larger sustainability movement. We're here to implement actions,
>> communicate concepts, and even, if I may be so bold, to offer advice, to
>> help achieve a sustainable human culture. We're not here to make everyone a
>> permaculturist or to claim certain methods as being or not being "part of
>> permaculture". Permaculture is a process we use toward a much larger end,
>> not a thing in itself. That's why I get mildly frustrated when people talk
>> about  their  "permaculture farm" or ask me if I want to "come see my
>> permaculture." I can't actually see permaculture any more than I can see
>> physics or design.
>>
>> Jason also gets to why I don't care if people use the P-word or not. In
>> many cases, calling an activity "permaculture" is off-putting or otherwise
>> counterproductive when what we want is a change in behavior and mindset,
>> not membership in "our" movement. Indigenous people living sustainably are
>> not permaculturists (I doubt if they are doing zone analysis and teaching
>> the general core model). They're just people living sustainably, and that's
>> the goal.
>>
>> And this gets to the heart of why I don't like to see permaculture
>> described as a "movement." In true social movements such as civil or
>> women's rights, or anti-war,  the goal is to achieve exactly what the
>> movement's name states: gaining enforceable rights for a group, or ending a
>> war. But the goal of permaculturists, I hope, is not to get everyone to
>> become  "copyrighted" capital P Permaculturists with a PDC certificate on
>> the wall, let alone to pass legislation enforcing permaculture design to be
>> applied everywhere. The goal is to bring people around to a whole-systems
>> paradigm so that humans will meet their needs in an ecologically sound way.
>> When civil rights legislation was passed and enforced, the civil rights
>> movement of that era disappeared and most of the activists turned to other
>> things. When a war ends, that anti-war movement dissipates. And when we are
>> all living sustainably, the "sustainability movement" will disappear. A
>> movement is just that: movement of people
>>    toward a behavior, and that movement stops when the behavior becomes the
>> norm. But when permaculture is part of society's mindset, the activities
>> known as permaculture design won't end the way the actions of the civil
>> rights movement did. We won't turn to other things. We'll keep on designing
>> and teaching the design system, and we'll still call it permaculture.
>>
>> As Larry Santoyo says, some day we will be embarrassed that we had to hold
>> classes in something that is so elementary and obvious.
>>
>> Toby
>> http://patternliteracy.com
>>
>>
>> On Dec 26, 2013, at 9:57 AM, Jason Gerhardt wrote:
>>
>>> Toby's "rant" is wonderful!
>>>
>>> I think there are two different ways of viewing/teaching permaculture out
>>> there, one is as a series of techniques, and the other is as an in-depth
>>> design process. I would just like to add to the conversation that viewing
>>> and teaching permaculture as a design process actually changes peoples
>>> lives.
>>>
>>> The techniques focus leads to the all too common student overwhelm of
>>> information (and subsequent disappointment when they find that certain
>>> techniques are totally inappropriate for their site, climate, or
>> whatever).
>>> For example, I could care less if my students can dig a swale after
>>> finishing a PDC with me if they can't properly site a swale (insert any
>>> technique).
>>>
>>> The real revolution of permaculture is in changing peoples lives, and
>> when
>>> people learn to think critically, think in systems, and think about
>>> everything through a lens of the permaculture ethics and principles then
>>> they become fundamentally different and changed people. For the better.
>> We
>>> have to remember that we're not promoting permaculture for the sake of
>>> permaculture*.* We're promoting permaculture as a way for people to
>>> significantly change their lives. Permaculture is not the goal, shifts in
>>> the way people think and act is the goal.
>>>
>>> One could also say that techniques are easy to sell, whereas processes
>> are
>>> far more difficult to close the deal on. This addresses the perennial
>>> threads of upholding standards and avoiding the commodification of
>>> permaculture. Those of us who think permaculture standards and
>> profiteering
>>> are important issues can best start by talking about permaculture as a
>>> design process, and by practicing that design process enough to where it
>>> fundamentally changes how we see, feel, think, and act.
>>>
>>> At best, techniques are fads particular to a place, time, and people.
>>> Design processes are what will actually lead to a more permanent culture.
>>>
>>> Humbly suggested,
>>>
>>> Jason Gerhardt
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> PO Box 4355
>>> Boulder, CO 80306
>>> 720-496-9744
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>> pioneers -- who are designing ecological land use systems with integrated
>> elements for synergy, sustainability, regeneration and enhanced
>> nature-compatible human habitat
>>
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>> Permaculture: -- portal to an expanding global network of landtech
>> pioneers -- who are designing ecological land use systems with integrated
>> elements for synergy, sustainability, regeneration and enhanced
>> nature-compatible human habitat
>>
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