[permaculture] Politcal talk-Yay or nay
listmail at lorendavidson.com
Tue Jun 26 11:16:31 EDT 2007
My personal opinion is that I find most political arguments to be
repetitive and boring, and they do not accomplish anything. Once it
gets to "fuck you," all chance of modifying someone's opinion in your
favor tends to sort of vanish with the morning dew. :)
That said...I think that there is definitely a place for a discussion
of politics on a Permaculture list, if it is done *in the context of
A good example might have to do with, say, how work on local food
independence or an initiative to reduce private transportation might
be encouraged or hindered by making changes to land use/zoning
legislation - how do we structure our cities and our transportation
infrastructure to reduce the amount of petroleum it uses, reduce the
number of wasted hours people spend in traffic that they could spend
getting to know their neighbors, reduce the auto exhaust? How do we
create urban and suburban spaces for food self-reliance?
Or how can issue X be tweaked in order to support the Pc principles
of "Care of the Earth" and "Care of the people?"
A bad example would be one that starts, "Al Franken is a liberal
idiot," or "Bill O'Reilly is a conservative idiot." It has zero
relevance to Permaculture or associated philosophies/sciences, it's
confrontative, and there really isn't a lot of common ground to be
had or solutions to be found in it.
The *problem* I see with political discussions is that, even when
they *start* with something like "How can we reform land use," they
tend to devolve into "Person X is a liberal/conservative idiot."
Followed by "*You* are a liberal/conservative idiot." This is partly
because many people carry a rather strong emotional charge around
their political views, many people really aren't all that tolerant of
disagreeing viewpoints, and email is too damn easy to misinterpret.
(Apologies to those who feel that the above example is too
US-centric. It's what I know. Please don't start an argument about
US-centrism, 'k? :) )
If people can act like mature adults, discuss the issues without
judgmentalism, try to relate what you're talking about to
Permaculture and Pc principles, and agree to disagree when things
warm up, then yeah, we might be able to make it a vital part of the
But if you're just gonna piss on each other's campaign slogans, do it
somewhere else. That's my two cents.
Loren Davidson listmail at lorendavidson.com
Music with tropical attitude - http://www.lorendavidson.com
"There's just too much to see waiting in front of me, and I know
that I can't go wrong" - J. Buffett
More information about the permaculture