[permaculture] what is "politics" exactly...?
Scott Vlaun
scott at moosepondarts.com
Mon Dec 10 16:37:40 EST 2007
Scott,
I really appreciate the thoughts below and your commitment to
changing the system. As someone who has worked for Seeds of Change
for many years promoting organic seeds, I often struggle with issues
about capitalism that you bring up below, no matter how important the
overall mission of the company. Since you, and other leading
permaculturists have also worked for SOC and its parent company M&M
Mars on Permaculture and sustainable production projects, how do you
see that as different than what Hawken, McDonough and others have
done to reform industrial capitalist enterprises?
It seems like we need to be working on all fronts; to stem the tide
and change the paradigm. Having that kind of capital to make big
projects happen isn't perfect, but it can be useful.
Scott Vlaun
Moose Pond Arts+Ecology
Design Solutions for a Sustainable Future
450 Main St. Studio 2
Norway, Maine 04268
207-739-2409 Studio
207-890-4099 Cell
http://www.moosepondarts.com
On Dec 7, 2007, at 2:09 PM, Scott Pittman wrote:
> This is a great thread and I want to add my two bits later but for
> now I
> would like to point out several of the people/books referenced by
> Keith in
> his list that I have trouble with.
>
> Amory Lovins, Paul Hawkins, William McDonough, and to some extent the
> Natural Step are all proponents of capitalism in a revised form.
> They are
> dangerous in my mind because they don't question the economic order
> but
> rather look to a reformed industrial state that will pollute less
> or be more
> energy conserving but don't question the very roots of the system.
> In my
> mind they are incredible dangerous because they allow people to
> feel good
> about the current arrangement so that they can continue to
> participate.
> It's like looking to biofuels to solve peak oil and then not
> dealing with
> our systems of transport and industrial processes. To have "good"
> guys like
> Al Gore internationally flogging biofuels and florescent bulbs as the
> solution to Global Warming creates warm feelings of false security,
> and set
> us back enormously.
>
> Paul Hawkin and a past hero of mine Lester Brown (founder of
> Worldwatch
> Institute) are both now looking to bio-technology (I read gmo food)
> as a
> solution to some of our problems.
>
> William McDonough excites everyone because of his Ford plant
> makeover that
> is solar oriented and lessens the waste stream. I'm not
> overwhelmed with
> this accomplishment when the men and women on the assembly lines in
> these
> architectural wonders are still doing the same mindless and soul
> eroding
> jobs.
>
> As I have mentioned before on this list I think there are a limits
> to growth
> in industry just as there are in nature and that once you exceed those
> limits you lose sustainability. It a tree branches one too many
> times it
> starves the last addition because of viscosity. Our industrial
> machine
> overcomes this by adding more energy (fuel) with the predictable
> outcome of
> pollution, lack of care of people and depletion of resources. It
> is built
> into the system.
>
> Capitalism by its very nature cannot be "Green".
>
> I would much rather see Ivan Illich on this list!
>
> Scott Pittman
> Director
> Permaculture Institute
> www.permaculture.org
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Keith Johnson [mailto:keithdj at mindspring.com]
> Sent: Friday, December 07, 2007 10:48 AM
> To: permaculture
> Subject: Re: [permaculture] what is "politics" exactly...?
>
> Stimulated by Paul Cereghino's assertion (or recommendation) that
>
> Permaculture design (even as applied to politics) should focus on
> analysis of actual processes and phenomena, flows, source, sink,
> etc...
>
>
> I Googled Ecology of Politics and Political Ecology to see what
> was out
> there that might correspond with Permacultural perspectives and found,
> not surprisingly, an interconnected web of familiar thoughts, people,
> books, theory and practice including:
>
> Social Ecology: In response to the social and ecological crisis in
> which we find ourselves immersed, social ecology advocates a
> reconstructive approach that promotes a directly democratic,
> confederal politics. As a body of ideas, social ecology
> envisions *a
> moral economy that moves beyond scarcity and hierarchy toward a
> world that fully celebrates diversity*.
>
> Social ecology is, in the words of its leading exponents, "a
> coherent profound critique of current social, political, and
> anti-ecological trends" as well as "a *reconstructive,
> ecological, communitarian, and ethical approach to society*".
>
> What literally defines social ecology as "social" is its
> recognition of the often overlooked fact that *nearly all our
> present ecological problems arise from deep-seated social
> problems*. Conversely, present ecological problems cannot be
> clearly understood, much less resolved, without resolutely
> dealing with problems within society. To make this point more
> concrete: *economic, ethnic, cultural, and gender conflicts,
> among many others, lie at the core of the most serious
> ecological dislocations we face today*--apart, to be sure,
> from
> those that are produced by natural catastrophes.
>
> Ivan Illich (who distinguishes between /environment as commons /
> from
> the /environment as resource)
>
> /Political ecology (which Wikipedia defines as) the study of how
> political, economic, and social factors affect environmental
> issues.
> The majority of studies analyze the influence that society, state,
> corporate, and transnational powers have on environmental problems
> and influencing environmental policy. There are many approaches to
> these issues, and some scholars give weight to the role that
> access
> to natural resources plays in structuring political and economic
> life: particularly how land degradation, 'fortress'-style wildlife
> conservation, or deforestation influences a range of social
> relations and politics.
>
> A number of books (for which I have created a new category at
> Permaculture Trading Post called Eco-Politics
> <http://astore.amazon.com/pctradingpost-20?%
> 5Fencoding=UTF8&node=32>
> and invite you to suggest other titles to add)
>
> Deep Ecology
>
> Noam Chomsky
>
> Dave Foreman (Earth First)
>
> Peter Kropotkin
>
> Eco-socialism
>
> Inclusive Democracy
>
> Green syndicalism
>
> Ecofeminism
>
> Gaia philosophy
>
> Greens
>
> Anarcho-primitivism
>
> Bioregionalism
>
> <http://astore.amazon.com/pctradingpost-20/detail/
> 0520236289/105-6154186-766
> 5265>
>
> Ecopsychology (what Mollison was teaching when he met David
> Holmgren, I've been told).
>
> Thomas Berry
>
> Appropriate technology
>
> Joanna Macy
>
> Anti-Globalization
>
> Amory Lovins
>
> William McDonough
>
> <http://astore.amazon.com/pctradingpost-20/detail/
> 0865475873/105-6154186-766
> 5265>
>
> Paul Hawken and Natural Capitalism
>
> <http://astore.amazon.com/pctradingpost-20/detail/
> 0316353000/105-6154186-766
> 5265>
>
> The Natural Step
>
> Derrick Jensen
> <http://astore.amazon.com/pctradingpost-20?%
> 5Fencoding=UTF8&node=29>
>
> Jarred Diamond
>
> Vandana Shiva
>
> Arundhati Roy
>
> E.O. Wilson
>
> ...and much more. If Permaculture represents "the connecting
> science", these provide many opportunities to connect the dots and
> build bridges between our local cultures and the living planet.
>
> Paul Cereghino wrote:
>>> Permaculture design (even as applied to politics) should focus on
>>> analysis of actual processes and phenomena. Flows, source, sink,
>>> etc... If natural systems are are the source of inspiration for
>>> ecological design, what is the source of inspiration for political
> design.
>>>
>>> More critically... what is the effective transitional system from
>>> current state to target state (least work greatest effect).
>>>
> --
> Keith Johnson
> "Be fruitful and mulch apply."
> Permaculture Activist Magazine
> PO Box 5516, Bloomington, IN 47407
> (812) 335-0383
> http://www.permacultureactivist.net
> http://www.PermacultureTradingPost.com
> Switch to Solar Power the Easy Way
> http://www.jointhesolution.com/KeithJ-SunPower
> http://www.PowUr.com/KeithJ-SunPower
> Blog: http://kjpermaculture.blogspot.com/
> also Patterns for Abundance Design & Consulting
> http://www.permacultureactivist.net/design/Designconsult.html
> also Association for Regenerative Culture
> http://www.ARCulture.org
> also APPLE-Bloomington (Alliance for a Post-Petroleum Local
> Economy) It's a
> small world after oil.
> http://www.relocalize.net/groups/applebloomington
> also Bloomington Permaculture Guild
>
>
>
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