[permaculture] Democratic solutions to Permaculture
kevin s
k.skvorak at verizon.net
Mon Aug 6 18:42:29 EDT 2007
I also want to express my gratitude for all of the sharing on this
topic. And i also want to express a profound senses of gratitude and
humility i feel for the opportunity of being taught by so many
wonderful teachers!
i really appreciate the deep sense many folks expressed that most of
what they value in their involvement in permaculture is primarily
experienced on the 'local' level
even though i started this thread, i also have some ambivalence as to
the real needs served by a national organization. virtually
everything we spend our time on here at our place, is based on our
local relationships, esp since we are primarily a CSA. these are all
very rewarding relationships, and we are happy to have come into a
pretty supportive community
and anyway, most of the invisible structures i am personally drawn
to, are basically focused on meeting very local needs for food,
resource sharing, 'mutual aid' type stuff , access to land, etc
(hey, btw, does anyone have any available statistics on what the
economic calculations on the value of non-monetary exchange, informal
barter etc.? it really seems like a pretty sizable piece of the
"economy", at least in rural areas)
like michael, i do not have much real engagement on a national
level, except perhaps by this wonderful listserv!, but i can
imagine, at least, some of the needs that might be served, and many
were articulated well by toby and others, and if there ever were such
an org, i like the possibilities embodied in membership type
organizations, esp since we are talking about relating on a National
level, probably implying Legal status under the State and so forth.
( like i said, i have some real ambivalence here! )
and i also express some gratitude as well to those who have already
worked so hard for much longer than i have on so many of the good
works that were woven in this 'thread', and feel i want to apologize
for the way that i 'framed' much of what i expressed, as i don't
think it expressed this respect very well at all!
thanks esp to michael and kathyann
best,
kevin
>
>
>From: KNat <knat at sprintmail.com>
>
>
>Perhaps a different view. Using more facets and less sides.
>Stating a concern one can see from their vantage point strengthens the
>ability of the group, to all see the same decision and its implications,
>to decide together. A concern of "negative" implication is not saying
>don't continue. It is merely saying "I see a potentially contrary
>reaction in this plan."
>The trust in the group, is to be brave enough to be the only one who
>sees it and speak your truth without fear of personal isolation.
>--------------------------
>
>From: Michael Burns
>Subject: Re: [permaculture] Democratic solutions to Permacultures
> conflicts?
>
>......
>The second problem is if you do not believe a national organization
>is needed or appropriate at this time, to disagree with Kevin's idea
>as presented also meant you would appear to agree with his
>characteraztions of those who would disagree as lacking in "trust in
>democratic process and organization," and prone to "individualistic
>trends." Earlier in his questions/proposal he suggested that we
>needed a process that "does not further divide us all, or place
>people in turf battles, or cause any of the other internal problems
>that seem to plague the 'movement'?
>
>Unwittingly, a discussion becomes framed as you are either for a
>democratic national organization OR if not you are an undemocratic
>individualist that accepts the divisions and turf battles. Egos,
>values, and our own personal worth are at stake and the original
>question becomes mired in distracting accusation, comparisons,
>personal declarations, and dormant and minor disagreements become
>divisions in a movement.
>...
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