[NAFEX] best apples article
ROBERT W JUDY A HARTMAN
hartmansfruit at msn.com
Mon Oct 22 23:44:08 EDT 2007
Mark,
I can only judge them by how they have been here (in western Washington). As I recall Gold Rush and Nova Spy fit that description. I just went out with my flashlight and picked a Nova Spy and a Gold Rush. The Nova Spy that I picked wasn't quite ripe enough. The Gold Rush was quite good. As they are grown here and to my taste buds as I recall from last year Suncrisp, Stellar, and Scarlet O'Hara had a little more tartness but I can still eat them. I didn't get any Delbard Estivale last year. I hope to taste it this year. Gold Rush is definitely crisp and sweet.
As you can see I made it a point to obtain these varieties to try here because they were on Ed's "best" list someplace. All these tend to ripen very late here in our climate. Your best bet is to try them there and see how they do. What I do is obtain different varieties that "sound good" and give them a try and if they don't work out here I have a friendly chipper and they are added back to the soil. One of the problems we have here is scab and I still have some varieties that are susceptible to scab that I need to get rid of. I just ate an Orei today that was delicious but you have to spray for scab. If you don't have the scab problem you might try Pink Sugar. It ripens late here and is very sweet and crisp but I don't know how it would do in a warm climate.
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark & Helen Angermayer<mailto:hangermayer at isp.com>
To: North American Fruit Explorers<mailto:nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 8:03 PM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
Big thanks Bob. Good information. The opinions are so varied on apple recommendations, sometimes you don't know who to listen to. I guess I've tried to pay close attention to Ed Fackler's advice. He has a reputation for not letting nostalgia bias his observations. And anybody who's raised 700 varieties of apples knows a thing or two. The thing I don't know is if his tastes are anything like mine. Probably not, I think I have more of a kid's palate. From what I've tasted, I like a real crisp sweet apple, as I said, like a Honeycrisp or Fuji. Some complexity, but more on the sweet end. Can't stand a Mac, too tart. Would you say any of those six heat friendly apples fit that description, sweet and crisp?
Mark
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Hartman
To: North American Fruit Explorers<mailto:nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
Mark,
As far as I know these sub-par Sweet Sixteens and Keepsakes were still grown around the Puget Sound area here in western Washington. My best guess is that they had too much shade either from the tree that they were on or from surrounding trees. I've had Keepsake at my place here at about 30 - 35 miles south of Seattle where they happened to be too shaded and they weren't that good either. Where we live the latitude isn't what makes the difference because we are south of Wenatchee (latitude wise) but they can grow the Fujis and other late ripening varieties and we generally can't ripen them here. We have the maritime climate because we are so close to the Puget Sound water and the Pacific Ocean influence. The Cascade Mountains are between us and Wenatchee in eastern Washington.
I did a search in old e-mails from Ed Fackler and here is what he had reported on for 1999:
Best apples for the 99 season (So. Indiana with a season of record
heat and drought)
1. GoldRush
2. Suncrisp
3. Delbard Estivale
4. NovaSpy
5. Stellar
6. Scarlet O'Hara
Worst apples of the season (due primarily to the intense heat)
1. Jonagold (soft flesh and weak flavor)'
2. Mutsu (much bitter pit)
3. Sweet 16 (soft flesh)
Have you tried the varieties that he said have done well for him? I have a lot of respect for Ed. He knows his apples
Bob Hartman
Western Washington
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark & Helen Angermayer<mailto:hangermayer at isp.com>
To: North American Fruit Explorers<mailto:nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
Bob,
Do you know where the sub-quality Sweet 16 & Keepsake were grown? In other words how far south were they grown? I would like to grow some good tasting apples down here in Kansas but we seem to be in the wrong location for growing any really good apples. I've heard were too far south for some of those great Minnesota apples (Keepsake, Honeycrisp, although I did plant a Sweet 16.) But supposedly they get mushy, drop, won't produce, or are just not very good quality with our hot summers (the Missouri extension doesn't even recommend Jonagold-another favorite-as it's too hot for it.) But I think we're too far north for Fuji, Pink Lady. They take 200 days to mature and I don't think we have quite that many growing days here, although I don't know how to calculate growing days. Ed Fackler once wrote he had 180 growing days in S. Indiana. I don't know how far south his orchard was, but I'm guessing it was close to my latitude, which is just south of Kansas City. I'm really looking for some apples which taste like-in order of preference- Honeycrisp, Fuji, or Pink Lady that have a similar crispness, which can be grown here. I think we're considered more or less on the Mason-Dixon line at 39 degrees latitude.
Mark
In no-man's land
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Hartman
To: North American Fruit Explorers<mailto:nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 2:42 PM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
Keepsake is also one of my favorite apples. It does well here in western Washington. It won't ripen well unless you have full sun on it in the September/October time of the year. Honeycrisp also does well here. It is very nice and crisp but doesn't match up with it's parent, Keepsake, in flavor. I also like the full flavored Sweet Sixteen, a sister to Keepsake, but it tends to not hold it's crispness very long.
I have seen and tasted Keepsake and Sweet Sixteen at fruit shows that were not grown very well and didn't have the flavor that I can grow them to. Under what conditions fruits have been grown makes a world of difference in how they taste.
Bob Hartman
Western Washington
----- Original Message -----
From: Kathryn Mathews<mailto:kathmath at charterinternet.com>
To: North American Fruit Explorers<mailto:nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 8:38 AM
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
Here in the "far north" (southern MN) I look forward every year to the
Keepsake apples. They are very crisp and sweet and have a lot more flavor
than Honeycrisp. They tend to be small in size and I think that's why they
aren't more popular.
Kathryn Mathews
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-----Original Message-----
From: nafex-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org<mailto:nafex-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org>
[mailto:nafex-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org]On Behalf Of Michael Nave
Sent: 10/21/2007 8:46 PM
To: North American Fruit Explorers
Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
I've had honeycrisp apples from many sources and I've
only had one bad one. But I've never had a great one
either and I suspect I never will. Honeycrisp is known
for being a great apple compared to other apples grown
in far northern areas. The University of MN has been
very clear in stating that it is one of the best
appples for growers in the northern limits of apple
growing range. I have never seen them claim that it is
a great apple compared to all other apples.
Nonetheless it is now being promoted and hyped
excessively by some growers, especially in parts of
New York state, far beyond anything that UM ever
intended, such as "the best apple ever". It's not even
in the ballpark for being the best apple ever. But it
will continue to be hyped by those who have financial
inetrests in it.
--- George Brinson <george.brinson at nf.sympatico.ca<mailto:george.brinson at nf.sympatico.ca>>
wrote:
> Interesting point on Honeycrisp..............I have
> eaten honeycrisp
> purchased at major supermarket outlets, from several
> sources in eastern
> Canada/USA and in all cases the taste is
> horrible..........I will not try
> this apple again. Not really crisp, and honey -
> forget it!!
>
> George Brinson
> Carmanville
> NL
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "William C. Garthright" <billg at inebraska.com<mailto:billg at inebraska.com>>
> To: "North American Fruit Explorers"
> <nafex at lists.ibiblio.org<mailto:nafex at lists.ibiblio.org>>
> Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2007 1:57 PM
> Subject: Re: [NAFEX] best apples article
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Someone mentioned Honeycrisp as a good storage
> apple that keeps its
> > crunch- maybe in CO2 storage but not out of my
> cellar!
>
>
> This is disappointing, because it's one of the
> varieties I planted, just
> for that reason (and because I like the taste, at
> least in grocery store
> apples). I've since discovered that it supposedly
> tastes best when there
> are cool nights when it ripens, so maybe this was a
> bad pick for two
> reasons.
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill
> Lincoln, NE (zone 5)
>
> --
> There is no society in human history that ever
> suffered because its
> people became too reasonable. - Sam Harris
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